v7.13.5 [stable] is released!

sirca · Sun Jan 14, 2024 7:54 am

Hi,
I have upgraded from 7.13 to 7.13.1 without issues:
1 CRS326-24G
1 CRS305
1 CRS317
1 CHR
But with an other CRS326-24G, the package upgrade process stucks at reboot. Still leds but no progress....
After 15 minutes I started the reset procedure with the reset button (no netinstall, just reset configuration).
Router rebooted and the console reports RouterOS 7.13 (no 7.13.1) and a script error.
Then restarted upgrade processes (package and firmware) without issue.
Reset with the new OS version, configured and in use without other odd behavoir.
Best Regards from Rome

kryztoval · Sun Jan 14, 2024 11:46 am

An almost clean and empty configuration RB941-2nD says that there is not enough space left on the device to update from 7.13 to 7.13.1 really bad for remote update since the only way to do an update would be to remove the wireless package, update, then reinstall new wireless package :(

[admin@Mikrotik] > /system/package/print
Columns: NAME, VERSION
# NAME      VERSION
0 wireless  7.13   
1 routeros  7.13

And this is the result of trying to update it

[admin@Mikrotik] > /system/package/update/install
            channel: stable
  installed-version: 7.13
     latest-version: 7.13.1
             status: ERROR: not enough disk space, 7.6MiB is required and only 7.6MiB is free

So close tho. So close.

Sun Jan 14, 2024 11:51 am

Netinstall might be the only way to get that version installed.
It will also clear any remaining clutter from previous versions occupying required storage space.

I do hope you first made a full export (not backup!) from that config ?

pe1chl · Sun Jan 14, 2024 12:21 pm

You should have left that device behind on a v6 release... I recommend 6.47.9
For your v7 adventures, buy a new router.

jdub88 · Sun Jan 14, 2024 1:50 pm

Just upgraded my hAP AX3. Upgrade was ok and the router returned after a few minutes but I have noticed a major drop in WiFi performance with devices dropping from 450mbps plus to 75

I must confess I'm rather confused by the changes and the docs but my admittedly brief skim of the docs didn't seem to suggest I'd need to do much on a new ish standalone device with plenty of disk space

Managing the device over a cable is tricky and I am keen to avoid breaking WiFi..is this performance drop due to the wrong package being used?

Sun Jan 14, 2024 1:59 pm

Wrong package would result in zero performance.
Are you sure frequency settings are not set to auto and maybe not optimal ?

Simonej · Sun Jan 14, 2024 3:36 pm

I have issues with the backup script.
I made an export then upload via FTP.
7.12.1 works, from 7.13 no.

The script is described here:
viewtopic.php?p=1048251

I may be wrong but noticed that now terminal is replacing spaces with _ , MT likes us to discover “fun” changes between the lines:
*) console - replace reserved characters in file and script names with underscores
and now is required also FTP policy for scripts.

jdub88 · Sun Jan 14, 2024 6:49 pm

Wrong package would result in zero performance.
Are you sure frequency settings are not set to auto and maybe not optimal ?

Thanks. Yeah, fair point. I have the wifi-qcom package which appears to be correct for my device

I am slightly confused by posts that say to change the package will mean that all prior wifi config is removed; I guess it's not one size fits all, my device came back up without issue.

Is it normal for traffic to bounce between wifi1 and wifi2? The performance of my ax3 has always been exceptional in the wifi department but the tests i've been doing are producing highly variable, but mostly low, results.

Sometimes when doing speedtests I see the traffic going up on wifi1; then other times wifi2

Looking at the config I guess wifi1 is the 5ghz radio and wifi2 is the 2.4ghz radio. I appreciate it's down to the client but i've never known my Mac for example to use 2.4ghz and be slow

pe1chl · Sun Jan 14, 2024 7:23 pm

I am slightly confused by posts that say to change the package will mean that all prior wifi config is removed; I guess it's not one size fits all, my device came back up without issue.

You did not change the package. So that does not apply to you. It only applies to those that have previously used the old "wireless" package and now are switching to "qcom-ac".

Mon Jan 15, 2024 11:38 am

What's new in 7.13.2 (2024-Jan-12 11:51):

*) leds - fixed default LTE LED configuration for wAPR-2nD;
*) lte - fixed cases where FG621-EA modem could be missing signal information in "lte monitor" (introduced in v7.13);
*) routerboard - added "reset-button" support for RBwAPR-2nD device;
*) sfp - improved combo-sfp handling for CRS328-4C-20S-4S+;
*) sfp - improved link establishment for RB4011 devices;
*) vlan - fixed non-running VLAN interface after failed MTU change;
*) wifi - fixed issue with setting country profile (introduced in v7.13.1);

rextended · Mon Jan 15, 2024 11:40 am

*) wifi - fixed issue with setting country profile (introduced in v7.13.1);

Thanks...

pe1chl · Mon Jan 15, 2024 11:43 am

SFP whack-a-mole seems to continue...

ZupoLlask · Mon Jan 15, 2024 1:00 pm

SFP issues flux is very weird indeed...

infabo · Mon Jan 15, 2024 1:07 pm

script error: error - contact MikroTik support and send a supout file

Still in 7.13.2. Created a support ticket for this (SUP-140530)

can confirm: country info is correct again.

masterlyar · Mon Jan 15, 2024 2:58 pm

And there is still nothing in 7.13.2 about the issue on RB5009UPr+S+ of the random reboot ?

 2024-01-14 06:18:50 system,error,critical router rebooted without proper shutdown, probably power outage

Maggiore81 · Mon Jan 15, 2024 3:38 pm

@normis are you planning to revert the modification with spaces? We have THOUSAND of MT on the network with spaces in the "system identity", and they are without backup.

onnoossendrijver · Mon Jan 15, 2024 3:41 pm

*) vlan - fixed non-running VLAN interface after failed MTU change;

I don't know if it is related, but I still need to disable/enable the underlying VLAN interface to make PPPoE work.
Strangely the logging tells me that PPPoE is connected and then terminates and reconnects, over and over again.
The setup is a router-on-a-stick via sfp-sfpplus1 on a RB5009. Vlan6 = internet, vlan100 = LAN and worked flawless on 7.12.x and earlier.

Some related configuration:

/interface bridge
add igmp-snooping=yes mtu=9796 name=bridge1 port-cost-mode=short vlan-filtering=yes
set [ find default-name=sfp-sfpplus1 ] l2mtu=9796 mtu=9796

/interface vlan
add interface=bridge1 mtu=1600 name=vlan6 vlan-id=6
add interface=bridge1 name=vlan100 vlan-id=100

/ppp profile
add name=profile-kpn-xs4all
/interface pppoe-client
add add-default-route=yes allow=pap disabled=no interface=vlan6 max-mtu=1500 name=pppoe-out1 profile=profile-kpn-xs4all use-peer-dns=yes user=blahblahblah

/interface bridge port
add bridge=bridge1 interface=sfp-sfpplus1 internal-path-cost=10 path-cost=10 pvid=100
/interface bridge vlan
add bridge=bridge1 comment=Internet tagged=bridge1,sfp-sfpplus1 vlan-ids=6
add bridge=bridge1 comment=LAN tagged=bridge1 untagged=ether1,ether2,ether3,ether4,ether5,ether6,ether7,ether8,sfp-sfpplus1 vlan-ids=100
add bridge=bridge1 comment="Native untagged" untagged=bridge1 vlan-ids=1

/interface list member
add interface=pppoe-out1 list=WAN
add interface=vlan100 list=LAN

rextended · Mon Jan 15, 2024 3:46 pm

@normis are you planning to revert the modification with spaces? We have THOUSAND of MT on the network with spaces in the "system identity", and they are without backup.

Don't tell me you made the mistake of installing an update in production before waiting at least 3 months in testing???

Simonej · Mon Jan 15, 2024 3:54 pm

@Maggiore81, don't know if this fit your case but, I'm using a basic script to create ROS backups and I was scared too when read
*) console - replace reserved characters in file and script names with underscores

with v7.14beta4

{
:local Identity [/system identity get name]
/system backup save dont-encrypt=yes name="Backup_$Identity"
}
Saving system configuration
Configuration backup saved

file created is -> Backup_RB4011 | CPE.backup with spaces!

mszru · Mon Jan 15, 2024 4:02 pm

System Resources
Code: Select all
                   uptime: 18h5m28s
                  version: 7.13.1 (stable)
               build-time: Jan/05/2024 13:51:11
         factory-software: 6.43.10
# ...
               board-name: hAP ac^2
                 platform: MikroTik
I do hope 7.14 will be more stable. Is it really time for netinstall, which I have never run for this device?
If you you have never ever Netinstalled this device not even for the changing to v7 series (which is the risk averse way to go) than it is definitely time for ... Netinstall latest stable or testing...

Thanks, I have netinstalled the router and got extra 200 KiB of free storage space.

Unfortunately the rsc file that I created just before the netinstall could not be imported. The import failed at the very first lines:

/disk
add slot1 slot=slot1 type=hardware
add usb1 type=hardware

The reason is perhaps missing default property "name" where those "slot1" and "usb1" values can be assigned to. I just cannot get how the export made in 7.13.1 cannot be imported by the same version (after netinstall)... So I removed that /disk section from the rsc and some other certificates related stuff and finally managed to import everything without errors.

mszru · Mon Jan 15, 2024 4:07 pm

script error: error - contact MikroTik support and send a supout file

I got the same message after the upgrade from 7.13.1 (netinstalled) to 7.13.2 on my hAP ac2.

erlinden · Mon Jan 15, 2024 4:16 pm

I got the same message after the upgrade from 7.13.1 (netinstalled) to 7.13.2 on my hAP ac2.

I don't see anything in the release notes about this item...

bajodel · Mon Jan 15, 2024 5:02 pm

(Device: hAP ac^2)
Log:
script error: error - contact MikroTik support and send a supout file (2)
error while running customized default configuration script: no such item

cyayon · Mon Jan 15, 2024 5:10 pm

And there is still nothing in 7.13.2 about the issue on RB5009UPr+S+ of the random reboot ?
Code: Select all
 2024-01-14 06:18:50 system,error,critical router rebooted without proper shutdown, probably power outage 

Hi, is there always random reboot with 7.13.1 ? did you also test 7.13.2 ?

thanks.

pe1chl · Mon Jan 15, 2024 6:45 pm

(Device: hAP ac^2)
Log:
script error: error - contact MikroTik support and send a supout file (2)
error while running customized default configuration script: no such item

I had that problem as well, a month ago, when I upgraded to 7.13. So I did what it mentions and sent a supout file.
Reply: "Thank you for your report, we will check what is causing the "script error"."
Apparently they did not get around to doing that.

nexusds · Mon Jan 15, 2024 9:19 pm

What's new in 7.13.2 (2024-Jan-12 11:51):

*) leds - fixed default LTE LED configuration for wAPR-2nD;
*) lte - fixed cases where FG621-EA modem could be missing signal information in "lte monitor" (introduced in v7.13);
*) routerboard - added "reset-button" support for RBwAPR-2nD device;
*) sfp - improved combo-sfp handling for CRS328-4C-20S-4S+;
*) sfp - improved link establishment for RB4011 devices;
*) vlan - fixed non-running VLAN interface after failed MTU change;
*) wifi - fixed issue with setting country profile (introduced in v7.13.1);

setting wifi to a country seems to get power to full value (ie canada 28 on 5GHZ 5745-5805) but on reboot goes to 8 on same frequency.. if you disable and re-enable interface it goes to 28 again properly. something on reboot isnt recognizing the right settings.

nexusds · Mon Jan 15, 2024 9:22 pm

on CRS326-24S+2Q+ had to disable L3Hw settings or traffic was very slow.

config is only a switch with vlans (no routing or firewall rules).

bajodel · Tue Jan 16, 2024 6:04 am

I had that problem as well, a month ago, when I upgraded to 7.13. So I did what it mentions and sent a supout file.
Reply: "Thank you for your report, we will check what is causing the "script error"."
Apparently they did not get around to doing that.

I thought it would show only on the first reboot after the upgrade, but messages are present also on the second reboot (I didn't go on testing though).
It's a lab device and I'm not gonna try on other device for now, I may netinstall the lab one but I'm pretty sure it's just a cosmetic one or might be something related to the Wireless->Wifi auto-conversion? (I'm not even sure there is one, I alway start from scratch ..so..).
The device works fine though, I quickly checked the export and everything seemed ok.

mkbatur · Tue Jan 16, 2024 8:29 am

I upgraded hAP ax³ to 7.13.2. Since I upgraded to this version I can't change the tx power.
2.4ghz always runs at tx16. Even if I change the country, it always works at tx 16 on the status screen and I cannot change it manually.

pe1chl · Tue Jan 16, 2024 11:39 am

I'm pretty sure it's just a cosmetic one or might be something related to the Wireless->Wifi auto-conversion? (I'm not even sure there is one, I alway start from scratch ..so..).
The device works fine though, I quickly checked the export and everything seemed ok.

There is no Wireless->Wifi conversion at all. That is a bit problematic when you manage the device via wireless (e.g. the typical NAT router at home managed from a laptop, or a PtP link device managed from the remote end of the link).
When you set Wireless to uninstalled and upload the qcom-ac package, then reboot, you lose the access to the device until you have connected an ethernet cable. Not always possible.
It would indeed have been nice when there was a one-time script that converts simple Wireless configurations (e.g. the default) into a WiFi configuration.
Of course it could be written by an external developer...

What the problematic script does is unclear, but it probably is a script that refers to "wireless" and that remains in place after the upgrade.
If it is cosmetic or more serious depends on how the script was written. Default behavior of RouterOS scripts is to exit upon this kind of errors, and when the script is a larger run-at-reset script that does things after this wireless thing, there could be subtle problems because that part is no longer run.

It seems somewhat serious as there is an explicit request to contact MikroTik about it. But then, there does not seem to be much attention to those reports.

masterlyar · Tue Jan 16, 2024 2:26 pm

And there is still nothing in 7.13.2 about the issue on RB5009UPr+S+ of the random reboot ?
Code: Select all
 2024-01-14 06:18:50 system,error,critical router rebooted without proper shutdown, probably power outage 
Hi, is there always random reboot with 7.13.1 ? did you also test 7.13.2 ?

thanks.

Hello, I was running 7.13.1 when I had this random reboot again. I've upgraded yesterday to 7.13.2 and had the reboot again during midnight today.
So yes either 7.13.[0,1,2] are having this random reboot issue. I will go back to 7.12.1 as it's the only one stable for now.

I'll appreciate if we can have a clear answer from mikrotik on this case, as it should be a priority for a release that is called "stable".

dvoijen · Tue Jan 16, 2024 2:45 pm

After upgrading from 7.12.1 to 7.13.2 still got the reboots.
system,error,critical router rebooted without proper shutdown, probably power outage
reverting back to 7.12.1

nmt1900 · Tue Jan 16, 2024 2:56 pm

I have been wondering for years about these "rebooted without proper shutdown, probably power outage" messages as this can be very misleading. It can point you to suspect hardware issues and whatnot - to be "magically cured" by subsequent firmware upgrade and never seen again.

It would be interesting to know how different error messages are selected in the code - can this one be the "generic" message for cases where actual reason for reboot cannot be exactly determined?

clambert · Tue Jan 16, 2024 3:18 pm

*) ethernet - improved packet CPU core classifier for Alpine CPUs for non IPv4/IPv6 traffic;

Great news!

Maggiore81 · Tue Jan 16, 2024 4:22 pm

@normis are you planning to revert the modification with spaces? We have THOUSAND of MT on the network with spaces in the "system identity", and they are without backup.
Don't tell me you made the mistake of installing an update in production before waiting at least 3 months in testing???

@rextended Yes I did that mistake

en1gm4 · Tue Jan 16, 2024 10:10 pm

RB750GR2 upgrade from 7.13.1 did not apply using the android app or webmin. it did upgrade when rebooted via winbox but then one of my vlans was disabled.
it only need to be re-enabled but as it runs my IOT it was a bit of a pain

Paternot · Wed Jan 17, 2024 2:36 am

RB750 Gr3.
Upgraded from 7.11 to 7.13.2
Everything working, so far: one IPsec peer, several Wireguard peers, about 2200 IPv6 routes through BGP with light filtering and PPPoE connection to my ISP.

kcarhc · Wed Jan 17, 2024 5:11 am

Please check ticket SUP-140482.

Requesting a fix for a DNS issue.
In version 7.13.1, there has been an occurrence of the DNS dynamic server going missing.
It appears to be a DNS crash.
It's confirmed that using the dns-to-address-list feature leads to the DNS crashing after a while.

Further tests in versions 7.13.2 and 7.13 also revealed this problem.
The system was upgraded from version 7.12, where everything was previously fine.

All devices that were upgraded from 7.12 and 7.12.x and use the dns-to-address-list feature are affected, especially the RB5009, which has a 100% occurrence rate. Please address this issue as soon as possible.

After some time of use, the DNS crashes.

kcarhc · Wed Jan 17, 2024 5:20 am

After encountering the issue, manually setting the DNS also doesn't work.

failure: dns server failure

bpwl · Wed Jan 17, 2024 11:27 am

*) wifi - use "Latvia" as default value for "country" property;

Well there is a potential problem for ax2/ax3 devices. (Power drop of 16dB in freq above 5700MHz, and those are choosen by default!)

viewtopic.php?t=203076#p1049300

bpwl · Wed Jan 17, 2024 11:30 am

I upgraded hAP ax³ to 7.13.2. Since I upgraded to this version I can't change the tx power.
2.4ghz always runs at tx16. Even if I change the country, it always works at tx 16 on the status screen and I cannot change it manually.

16dBm in 2.4 GHz is correct for European countries. (20dBm EIRP -4dBm antenna gain)
viewtopic.php?t=203076#p1049300

bpwl · Wed Jan 17, 2024 11:37 am

Double identical topics in this forum ?????

viewtopic.php?p=1049311#p1049309

mkx · Wed Jan 17, 2024 12:21 pm

I upgraded hAP ax³ to 7.13.2. Since I upgraded to this version I can't change the tx power.
2.4ghz always runs at tx16. Even if I change the country, it always works at tx 16 on the status screen and I cannot change it manually.
16dBm in 2.4 GHz is correct for European countries. (20dBm EIRP -4dBm antenna gain)
viewtopic.php?t=203076#p1049300

It should be possible to set this value lower ... but it's not clear if @mkbatur tried to lower the value.
Another thing is that a few years ago @Normis explained that actual Tx power is lowest of the following values: a) country regulated EIRP less antenna gain b) value set as Tx power (tx-power property) and c) wireless chipset capability (which takes also different rates into consideration). And if this is still true, then it should be possible to set tx-power property to anything (even to 50dBm), but the power selection algorithm will then largely disregard this setting.

bpwl · Wed Jan 17, 2024 2:06 pm

TX power in "status" looks like it is the EIRP calculation (allowed power - antenna gain value set), without using the power set for "all rates fixed".
External devices measuring power (e.g. other MT AP or client APP) do show further reduction of the emitted power if "all rates fixed" value is lowered below the above calculated value.

This makes the "all rates fixed" so unpractical. Where does it start functioning? I still use the "antena gain correction factor", which normally also is supposed to take care of the frequency specific limit and the needed reduction for higher MCS. See "Ron Touw" presentation, last minutes ... viewtopic.php?t=203076&hilit=Touw#p1048198

@Normis answered on this earlier with ... something I didn't like. ( use card rates, antenna gain is physical, ....) in 6.47 release discussions... but I'm glad it's back in wifiwave2.

ksteink · Wed Jan 17, 2024 5:25 pm

Sorry to say it but this new version has been a mess.. too much confusing information, too many issues (Random reboot, wrong country, fixed TX, random errors, fetch tool broken, etc.). I am skipping this version until I see it more stable :(

mkx · Wed Jan 17, 2024 7:36 pm

I still use the "antena gain correction factor", which normally also is supposed to take care of the frequency specific limit and the needed reduction for higher MCS.

Antenna gain settings indeed kick in with frequency specific limit. But why would you want that? E.g. ETSI limit for part around 5800MHz is quite low. Why would you want to use even lower EIRP?

Antenna gain doesn't affect needed reduction for higher MCS, for that the chipset limitations kick in at Tx power output from chipset. So actual EIRP at higgest rates will be the same for all (normal) antenna gain settings, only the breaking point (between limiting by country regulations and limiting by chipset capability) will move towards higher MCS. This is, BTW, the same as if Tx power was limited by setting "configuration.tx-power" (BTW, setting "all rates fixed" doesn't exist any more and the last part of Ron's presentation doesn't apply any more approximately since the discussion with Normis you also mentioned), setting this property largely affects (if at all) Tx power used at lower MCS. IMO the benefit of setting "tx-power" compared to antenna gain is that frequency specific country limits affect EIRP less (if "tx-power" is set low, then frequency specific limits doesn't affect EIRP at all, which in turn means same coverage range regardless the actual frequency used, whereas with setting higher antenna gain coverage does vary according to frequency limits.

bpwl · Wed Jan 17, 2024 8:22 pm

There are cases where it is just practical, but just having a % slider would have been better. Maintaining the special dynamics of wifi "to make it work"
Who on this forum is capable of finding the setting for let's say LHG 5, without consulting the EIRP levels of the country and the HW documentation (antenna gain 25dBi) , or want to run a Netbox 5 at 22dB , where it could be 31dB when rate drops..

"all rates fixed" is still there in ROS 7.12 on hAP ac2 for WLAN driver. Normis's "card rates" was gone long ago.

But yes with wifiwave2 we lost all this control. The list of CONS is a bit longer than listed in the docs.
(No B-filtering, no radio name in beacon (Scan), no wifi information in DUDE "RouterOS info" (registration table), But we have relative power now again, with antenna gain setting. (It can be set, but maybe just not used? But "status" adjusts its value correctly if set higher than "Antenna Gain Minimum")
And also "TX-power" can be set as : A limit on the transmit power (in dBm) of the interface. Can not be used to set power above limits imposed by the regulatory profile. Unset by default.

"ETSI limit for part around 5800MHz is quite low" ... and a trap for many novice buyers who use these AP's out-of-the-box, confident about the "good" default setting.

pe1chl · Wed Jan 17, 2024 9:50 pm

I don't understand the need to set Tx power separately for all different rates. There is a chip max Tx power for each rate, and there is a calculated Tx power depending on the desired (and allowed) EIRP combined with the antenna gain.
Whenever the calculated Tx power exceeds the chip max Tx power for that rate, it should be capped to the maximum.
In cases like the LHG 5 that will usually not happen, because the allowed EIRP minus the antenna gain is more than 10dB below the available Tx power. For omni antennas (and those not respecting the law) it is of course different. But still, a single "EIRP" slider should be more than enough (so you can run below max power when desired).

rextended · Thu Jan 18, 2024 10:57 am

Missing on changelog 7.13.1 (or 7.13.2):

*) fetch - treat any 2xx HTTP return code as success (introduced in v7.13)

ZupoLlask · Thu Jan 18, 2024 12:33 pm

I guess MikroTik now must focus on the random reboots issue...

rextended · Thu Jan 18, 2024 12:36 pm

I guess MikroTik now must focus on the random reboots issue...

If it was a reply to my post,
I probably expressed myself badly:
it solved the problem, but it's not written in the changelog.

whatever · Thu Jan 18, 2024 1:41 pm

I guess MikroTik now must focus on the random reboots issue...

None of my devices is suffering from random reboots, so this is probably dependant on your specific configuration.

masterlyar · Thu Jan 18, 2024 4:54 pm

I guess MikroTik now must focus on the random reboots issue...
None of my devices is suffering from random reboots, so this is probably dependant on your specific configuration.

Many of us are having this issue, so I guess you don't have openvpn tunnel configured and/or wireguard tunnel ?

mkx · Thu Jan 18, 2024 4:59 pm

None of my devices is suffering from random reboots, so this is probably dependant on your specific configuration.
Many of us are having this issue, so I guess you don't have openvpn tunnel configured and/or wireguard tunnel ?

So it's not entirely random, it's tied to some particular configuration. I'd say that's an useful input for mikrotik devs who will try to chase the problems down.

And I agree with @whatever, none of my devices (running 7.13) suffer from reboots either. Indeed I'm not using neither openvpn nor wireguard nor DoH.

sirbryan · Thu Jan 18, 2024 5:46 pm

So it's not entirely random, it's tied to some particular configuration. I'd say that's an useful input for mikrotik devs who will try to chase the problems down.

And I agree with @whatever, none of my devices (running 7.13) suffer from reboots either. Indeed I'm not using neither openvpn nor wireguard nor DoH.

I'm running 7.13.2 on a number of devices, and a couple of them do have wireguard tunnels, including the 2116 I use as my home/office router and use Wireguard daily from my phone and/or laptop to get back into the network. Neither those with nor those without wireguard have rebooted randomly.

ZupoLlask · Thu Jan 18, 2024 6:32 pm

So, people with reboots must send their supout files to Mikrotik, please. 🙂

sx10 · Thu Jan 18, 2024 6:45 pm

Yes, this is happening to me as well!

Please check ticket SUP-140482.

Requesting a fix for a DNS issue.
In version 7.13.1, there has been an occurrence of the DNS dynamic server going missing.
It appears to be a DNS crash.
It's confirmed that using the dns-to-address-list feature leads to the DNS crashing after a while.

Further tests in versions 7.13.2 and 7.13 also revealed this problem.
The system was upgraded from version 7.12, where everything was previously fine.

All devices that were upgraded from 7.12 and 7.12.x and use the dns-to-address-list feature are affected, especially the RB5009, which has a 100% occurrence rate. Please address this issue as soon as possible.

After some time of use, the DNS crashes.

Etz · Thu Jan 18, 2024 7:12 pm

So, people with reboots must send their supout files to Mikrotik, please. 🙂

I have support ticket open with them.
My config is really basic, my ax2’s act as AP’s.
Only special thing is that they are managed by CapsMan. Before 7.13 they were also rock stable.

Each time they crash, I dump autosupout’s and attach to that ticket.

sergiobeltrao · Thu Jan 18, 2024 7:27 pm

Hi, I upgraded my hAP ac2 from ROS v7.11 to version 7.13.2, but now I cannot install the ZeroTier package because the device lacks free space, even though I don't have any files or any other packages but the main and the wireless ones. Can something still be done about the packages size in future releases?

pe1chl · Thu Jan 18, 2024 7:51 pm

No, hAP ac2 is finished. The flash space has run out and MikroTik is unwilling to do something about it (see discussion in 7.14beta topic).

cyayon · Thu Jan 18, 2024 7:55 pm

Hi,
just upgraded CRS328-24P-4S+ from 7.10.2 -> 7.12.1 -> 7.13.2 (packages and routerboard firmware), and got this error message in logs :

Failed to upgrade poe FW on , diag code 80/328

Is this normal ?

thanks

mkx · Thu Jan 18, 2024 9:39 pm

No, hAP ac2 is finished. The flash space has run out and MikroTik is unwilling to do something about it (see discussion in 7.14beta topic).

Seems that MT finally admitted that hAP ac2 is a great wireless-less router. With only system bundle of 7.13 installed and without any wireless/wifi package, flash has still almost 3MB free space. Yay! Time for setting up some stupid country address lists to bloat configuration database...

bpwl · Thu Jan 18, 2024 11:00 pm

Just upgraded my hAP AX3. Upgrade was ok and the router returned after a few minutes but I have noticed a major drop in WiFi performance with devices dropping from 450mbps plus to 75

...

Managing the device over a cable is tricky and I am keen to avoid breaking WiFi..is this performance drop due to the wrong package being used?

See viewtopic.php?t=203076#p1049300
SRD frequencies in use while using "auto"? Now with ROS7.13.1 default Country is Latvia. SRD wifi frequencies allowed power change in 7.13.1 from FCC region default to Latvia country default ... this is a drop from 30dB to 14dB .. 16 dB drop (=40x) for those frequencies. Unchanged "auto" prefers to select SRD frequencies.

sergiobeltrao · Fri Jan 19, 2024 12:08 am

No, hAP ac2 is finished. The flash space has run out and MikroTik is unwilling to do something about it (see discussion in 7.14beta topic).

I just saw the discussion on the 7.14 beta topic, and I really hope that MikroTik decides to split some functions into different packages so we can have a smaller main one. I was able to get ZeroTier for now by using "wireless" instead of "wifi-qcom-ac," but the free space left is barely enough to make a single backup of my config. I also downloaded the 7.14beta7 npk, and it's already bigger than the 7.13.2... sad day for my old hAP ac².

peich1 · Fri Jan 19, 2024 5:06 am

So it's not entirely random, it's tied to some particular configuration. I'd say that's an useful input for mikrotik devs who will try to chase the problems down.

And I agree with @whatever, none of my devices (running 7.13) suffer from reboots either. Indeed I'm not using neither openvpn nor wireguard nor DoH.

Capture.JPG

Probably the problem lies in OpenVPN (as it happened before, and Mikrotik took *months* to have it fixed). No autosup generated. Let's hope that they work on this, it's getting really frustating having these kind of problems on and off since I upgraded to version 7 (I have a RB5009, btw).

Ovic · Fri Jan 19, 2024 8:49 am

I have also a RB5009 with openvpn client on running on it. Since version 7.13.1 the reboots magically stopped, but with 7.13 there were once or even twice a day. Even netinstalled as support suggested, but 7.13 wasn't playing nice. Don't know what was changed between version 7.13 and 7.13.2 as the support team failed to reproduce the error. Anyway I hope that when 7.14 goes stable doesn't break it again.

peich1 · Fri Jan 19, 2024 3:43 pm

I have also a RB5009 with openvpn client on running on it. Since version 7.13.1 the reboots magically stopped, but with 7.13 there were once or even twice a day. Even netinstalled as support suggested, but 7.13 wasn't playing nice. Don't know what was changed between version 7.13 and 7.13.2 as the support team failed to reproduce the error. Anyway I hope that when 7.14 goes stable doesn't break it again.

I'm running 7.13.1. So 7.13.2 is stable now?

Ovic · Fri Jan 19, 2024 3:51 pm

At least for me it is. Running it for about 4 days with openvpn, wireguard , queues and ospf in the mix.

Etz · Fri Jan 19, 2024 4:01 pm

So 7.13.2 is stable now?

Nope my ax2's are still rebooting.

flapviv · Fri Jan 19, 2024 4:07 pm

So 7.13.2 is stable now?
Nope my ax2's are still rebooting.

Hello,

CCR2004 (multiple bpg fullview), many LB5009, many RB5009, many AX3 are just fine here ;-)

ykleet · Fri Jan 19, 2024 6:28 pm

It is probably just me, but upgrading from 7.12 to 7.13 on AWS broke the instance again and it does not boot any longer.

I had the same issue upgrading to 7.12 and was forced to recreate the instance.

Isn't there anything I can do to just get the upgrade on AWS working properly?

--Michael

I had similar problem after upgraded from 7.13.1 to 7.13.2. I have a script to reboot the ac2 every morning. After upgraded to 7.13.2, it does not able to boot up. All I have to do is restore from a 7.13.1 backup image (all wifi interfaces, 2 physical and 3 virtual, are disable), then it can boot up. Also, reset to factory config can boot up too.

jriera · Fri Jan 19, 2024 8:22 pm

We have a problem with > 7.12 and OSPF, some (active) routes are duplicated with the same nexthop, it doesn't make sense.

Please see attachment:

routes duplicated.png

Dario1982 · Sat Jan 20, 2024 8:12 pm

I found a possible bug after the upgrade to 7.13.2 on a SXT R RBSXTR rev.3 with LTE modem R11e-LTE6 on V036.

Today I upgraded the SXT from 7.13 directly to 7.13.2 and after the upgrade, although the LTE interface connects to the carrier without problem, the status LEDs remain off and do not report the signal stenght.
After the downgrad to 7.13 the status LEDs are back.

I tested also with 7.13.1 and I found that also with this version the LEDs remain off, so it seems somethning intuduced with 7.13.1.
I checked the changelog but I didn't find anything pointing to possible different way of managing the LEDs.

To see if the problem is only occurring with the parameter "modem-signal" I changed the rule to
/system leds add interface=lte1 leds=led1,led2,led3 modem-type=modem-technology
But also in this case the LEDs remain off.

kalamaja · Sat Jan 20, 2024 11:50 pm

Just upgraded my hAP AX3. Upgrade was ok and the router returned after a few minutes but I have noticed a major drop in WiFi performance with devices dropping from 450mbps plus to 75

1) Check the bridge’s protocol-mode, with AX2/AX3 it MUST be default value (rtsp).
2) Set 5GHz frequency from auto to less than 5730, other

pe1chl · Sun Jan 21, 2024 12:17 pm

1) Check the bridge’s protocol-mode, with AX2/AX3 it MUST be default value (rtsp).

Why?

whatever · Sun Jan 21, 2024 12:24 pm

You just have to ensure that hardware acceleration is disabled, as it is still buggy on these switch chips. Enabling rstp is one possibility to do that

kalamaja · Sun Jan 21, 2024 1:14 pm

1) Check the bridge’s protocol-mode, with AX2/AX3 it MUST be default value (rtsp).
Why?

No idea, found it out hard way by diffing configurations, why AX3 had much worse performance than AC2. With protocol-mode=rtsp all good and 1200@5GHz/AX as promised.

sirbryan · Mon Jan 22, 2024 7:22 pm

So, people with reboots must send their supout files to Mikrotik, please. 🙂

After posting that I had had none, I had two within the past 72 hours, one a 1036 and the other a CRS317.

The only difference between the weeks (and months) of them running without reboots and the last couple of days was my use of Winbox to configure/manage/monitor them as I integrate more gear into the stack. I'd be curious to see if others who have experience reboots with 7.13 have also left Winbox open/running on a computer somewhere during the time that their router or switch rebooted. (Note this is 7.13 on these two boxes, not 7.13.1 or 7.13.2.)

pe1chl · Mon Jan 22, 2024 8:32 pm

7.13 crashing when winbox is left open is a known bug

Dario1982 · Mon Jan 22, 2024 9:31 pm

Update about my case of LEDs not working on SXT R with LTE6 (previous generation).
Support confirmed is a bug and will be addressed in the next stable release.

sirbryan · Mon Jan 22, 2024 11:00 pm

7.13 crashing when winbox is left open is a known bug

OK. Makes me feel better. Sort of. I thought I had seen/read it before.

lolman10 · Wed Jan 24, 2024 3:21 pm

i s it still possible downrage v7.12 or v6 ?

Kanzler · Wed Jan 24, 2024 3:24 pm

Yes, you can downgrade. I use 7.12. It stable for me

lolman10 · Wed Jan 24, 2024 3:30 pm

Yes, you can downgrade. I use 7.12. It stable for me

i updated 7.13.2 but i cant downrage back . its not work like before i downrage

Kanzler · Wed Jan 24, 2024 3:39 pm

Try removing the wireless package first. Then, perform a downgrade without the wireless package. I hope you are connected via cable, not WiFi.

rextended · Wed Jan 24, 2024 3:49 pm

i updated 7.13.2 but i cant downrage back . its not work like before i downrage

What device is it and what is written in the logs?

Amm0 · Wed Jan 24, 2024 3:53 pm

i updated 7.13.2 but i cant downrage back . its not work like before i downrage
What device is it and what is written in the logs?

And if logs report disk space as issue... you may be able to copy to PC and remove the backup files to free space before attempting downgrade.

zandhaas · Wed Jan 24, 2024 3:55 pm

Try removing the wireless package first. Then, perform a downgrade without the wireless package. I hope you are connected via cable, not WiFi.

It's not "Try" but it is necessary otherwise the process tries to find a version of the wireless package to downgrade. But that package does not exist so downgrade will fail.

zhazell · Wed Jan 24, 2024 4:03 pm

Just to let everybody knows, I have reported (SUP-128622) a memory leak on version v7.11.2, that continued on v7.12, v7.12.1 and v7.13. It seems to me and my undestandings of the supout files provided data, that it's still DNS resolver related.

I had initially reported a leak, that turned out to be really DNS resolver related, on v7.7 (SUP-105183, 20/January/2023), but it was fixed for the majority of my MK routers with v7.8rc2 and forward. But at least in one case, I'm still experiencing it, while having no real answers from Mikrotik Support Team on the SUP-128622 Support ticket. People just keep asking me to update to latest and provide new supout files, despite no changelog regarding leak or DNS changes.

With no other real options, I'm here asking for some help of the Mikrotik Staff Team that watches this community regarding the ticket SUP-128622

Here's an updated screenshot of memory usage on a RB2011 box with v7.13 over the last 8 (eight) days. IP/DNS is configured to use max of 16MB with cache data, but that amount was clearly not respected and usage is just growing, indefinitely, until the box crashes or I reboot it. The RB2011 is not a big memory box, with 128MB only, thus 25% of memory usage (that is all being used by the resolver process, confirmed by the supout provided data) is about 32MB, far beyond the 16MB configured limit.

PLEASE, HELP
.
mk leak.png

I have been experiencing the same thing across multiple Mikrotik devices. Opened a ticket with Mikrotik Support (SUP-136194) and they determined it was DNS related, but none of the newer 7.14beta releases seems to be fixing it. DNS Cache size is clearly not respected and usage continues to grow. Once the cache limit is reached (less than 24 hours), I'm not able to "clear cache" or get the DNS Cache Used any less than what it's set to unless I reboot (or it crashed due to out of memory condition). The DNS cache table then does not show anything but static records (even though the cache is full???). It's a very strange bug and has been plaguing me.

Keeping most of our devices on 7.8 as it seems most of our routers are stable with that version, except a few where I've been the new 7.14beta to not real fix yet.

Hope they can get this resolved.

You can see where memory continues to climb until it crashes.

Screenshot 2024-01-24 at 9.06.20 AM.png

lolman10 · Wed Jan 24, 2024 4:14 pm

sorry im noob. what i must write terminal for see logs ?

rextended · Wed Jan 24, 2024 4:19 pm

No terminal, go on winbox/webfig "Log"

lolman10 · Wed Jan 24, 2024 5:48 pm

i updated 7.13.2 but i cant downrage back . its not work like before i downrage
What device is it and what is written in the logs?

0 2023-12-23 07:52:45 memory system, info router rebooted
2 2023-12-23 07:52:50 memory wireless, info AB:3f:44:C3:CC:55@wlan1 established connection on 5180000, SSID 5ghz
3 2023-12-23 07:52:52 memory bridge, info hardware offloading activated on bridge "bridge1" ports: ether1
4 2023-12-23 07:52:55 memory interface, info ether1 link up (speed 100M, full duplex)
5 2023-12-23 07:53:02 memory system, info, account user admin logged in from 192.168.1.10 via winbox
6 2023-12-23 07:53:04 memory system, info, account user admin logged in from 192.168.1.10 via winbox
7 2023-12-23 07:53:13 memory system, info, account user admin logged in from 192.168.1.10 via web
8 2024-01-24 14:23:51 memory system, critical, info cloud change time Dec/23/2023 07:54:12 => Jan/24/2024 14:23:51
9 2024-01-24 17:24:20 memory system, info, account user admin logged out from 192.168.1.10 via web
10 2024-01-24 18:08:01 memory system, info, account user admin logged out from 192.168.1.10 via winbox
11 2024-01-24 18:08:01 memory system, info, account user admin logged out from 192.168.1.10 via winbox
12 2024-01-24 18:24:43 memory interface, info ether1 link down
13 2024-01-24 18:25:13 memory interface, info ether1 link up (speed 100M, full duplex)
14 2024-01-24 18:25:20 memory interface, info ether1 link down
15 2024-01-24 18:25:21 memory interface, info ether1 link up (speed 100M, full duplex)
16 2024-01-24 18:25:24 memory interface, info ether1 link down
17 2024-01-24 18:25:25 memory interface, info ether1 link up (speed 100M, full duplex)
18 2024-01-24 18:25:30 memory interface, info ether1 link down
19 2024-01-24 18:25:31 memory interface, info ether1 link up (speed 100M, full duplex)
20 2024-01-24 18:30:07 memory system, info, account user admin logged in from AB:3f:44:C3:AA:55 via winbox
21 2024-01-24 18:31:29 memory system, info, account user admin logged in from AB:3f:44:C3:AA:55 via winbox
22 2024-01-24 18:31:31 memory system, info, account user admin logged out from AB:3f:44:C3:AA:55 via winbox
23 2024-01-24 18:32:52 memory system, info, account user admin logged in from 192.168.1.90 via web

i downrage but i want to ask about another problem.

İ have mikrotik Mikrotik LDF 5 . This device is connected to the TpLink WR841N V11 indoor device with a cat6 cable. Wifi disconnects itself at random times. It gets fixed when you restart the TP Link device. If I do not put a wifi password on the TP Link device, there is no problem. i tried that with another indoor acess point. problem didnt fixed.. i got same problem. i know its about mikrotik problem

Kanzler · Wed Jan 24, 2024 5:54 pm

İ have mikrotik Mikrotik LDF 5 . This device is connected to the TpLink WR841N V11 indoor device with a cat6 cable. Wifi disconnects itself at random times. It gets fixed when you restart the TP Link device. If I do not put a wifi password on the TP Link device, there is no problem. i tried that another indoor acess point. i have same problem. so i know its about mikrotik

Please open a separate topic for this issue. Since this issue is unrelated to the topic being discussed here.

mszru · Wed Jan 24, 2024 7:29 pm

hAP ac2 runs stable after netinstalling of 7.13.2, no more random reboots. Uptime is 9 days.

There are other issues which are not related this this release, but all ROS v7 lineup:

SSH forwarding stability.
PuTTY sometimes fails with "SSH2_MSG_CHANNEL_REQUEST for half-open channel 316".
Here is how I use it: Firefox => Proxy Toggle extension (SOCKS4, localhost:port) => PuTTY => Router
2024-01-24 18_57_26-Window.png

Socks service stability.
The service stops working when extensive data exchange is happening. Disabling/enabling the service brings it back to life. To do that automatically I added Netwatch for 127.0.0.1, tcp-conn, port 1080 and check the status every 10 seconds. It is easy to reproduce this issue using Telegram desktop app: add a socks5 proxy in advanced settings and start scrolling through your favorite channels.
2024-01-24 19_21_58-Window.png

Has anyone else encountered this? I have not reported these problems to support yet.

rushlife · Thu Jan 25, 2024 9:02 am

viewtopic.php?p=1051369&hilit=disk+space#p1051359

I have problem with that to. Reset resolved anything unfortunately.
NetInstall is not doable, unit placed on very difficult place to reach.

Thu Jan 25, 2024 11:26 am

What's new in 7.13.3 (2024-Jan-24 15:16):

*) dns - fixed DNS service crash when DoH used (introduced in v7.13.1);
*) fetch - fixed fetch when using "src-path" with SFTP mode (introduced in v7.13);
*) fetch - less verbose logging (introduced in v7.13);
*) health - show voltage when powering KNOT R through Micro-USB;
*) lte - fixed Simcom modem support in 0x9001 USB composition;
*) lte - improved SIM PIN unlock event handling for MBIM FG621-EA;
*) poe-out - fixed "power-cycle" for CRS354-48P-4S+2Q+ device (introduced in v7.13);
*) poe-out - improved PoE out reliability on routers with a single PoE out interface;
*) sms - fixed SMS inbox for FG621-EA modem (introduced in v7.13);
*) sms - fixed SMS sending from WinBox and WebFig (introduced in v7.13);
*) sms - improved system stability when working with SMS (introduced in v7.13);
*) system - properly close HTTP/S connections initiated by the router;
*) tftp - improved invalid request processing;
*) wifi-qcom - improved system stability when using FastPath (introduced in v7.13);

Etz · Thu Jan 25, 2024 11:49 am

*) wifi-qcom - improved system stability when using FastPath (introduced in v7.13);

Is it related to device reboots, due to kernel failure?

infabo · Thu Jan 25, 2024 12:58 pm

*) dns - fixed DNS service crash when DoH used (introduced in v7.13.1);

I did not notice any DNS service crashes despite using DoH in 7.13.1/7.13.2.......

eworm · Thu Jan 25, 2024 1:09 pm

I think the DNS service crashes happened in combination with an active hotspot. That was what I was suffering.

infabo · Thu Jan 25, 2024 1:11 pm

*) dns - fixed DNS service crash when DoH and hotspot used (introduced in v7.13.1);

Jotne · Thu Jan 25, 2024 1:22 pm

I may be in other situation as well so adding "hotspot" may not be needed.

infabo · Thu Jan 25, 2024 1:36 pm

feel free

Chupaka · Thu Jan 25, 2024 2:30 pm

*) wifi-qcom - improved system stability when using FastPath (introduced in v7.13);
Is it related to device reboots, due to kernel failure?

And... Is it only about wifi-qcom, not wifi-qcom-ac?

ormandj · Thu Jan 25, 2024 3:55 pm

[Edit: there was an issue with dhcp service that lead to my connectivity problems, it was unrelated to upgrade. just a race condition situation i was able to resolve through a modified configuration.]

erlinden · Thu Jan 25, 2024 4:11 pm

Have you tried by MAC Address, @ormandj? Haven't seen this in my environment (RB4011/hAP ax2/hEX S/cAP ac/cAP XL ac/wAP ac)

Network5 · Thu Jan 25, 2024 7:06 pm

Today I was trying to import the configuration from our production router that runs ROS 7.13 on CCR2216 to our lab router, CCR2216 running ROS 7.13 to test the 7.13.3. Resetting the configuration and running the script from there it gives an error because of line in bold. Removed that it worked. (There is also an error on /MPLS/traffic-eng/path, but this should be blank.)

/interface wireless security-profiles
set [ find default=yes ] supplicant-identity=MikroTik
#error exporting "/mpls/traffic-eng/path" (timeout)

pe1chl · Thu Jan 25, 2024 7:31 pm

Apparently your production router has the wireless package installed, and your test router does not.
It is a "normal problem" with MikroTik. You usually cannot do "reset configuration and import script" because there can be minor errors and they are not handled.
You could overcome this by doing "reset configuration without defaults", then connect to the router via MAC address, open terminal and paste the exported text.
The errors still occur but the configuration would continue with the next line.
There really should be an "ignore minor errors" and a "log to file" option there, but I have asked for that for years and it never got implemented...

Thu Jan 25, 2024 9:17 pm

Not really ... already observed for internal MT releases.

laurinkus · Thu Jan 25, 2024 11:15 pm

Is it possible to downgrade hAP ac² from 7.13.3 to 7.12.2 without using netinstall? It is running extremely low on disk space.

> system/resource/print
uptime: 1h1m3s
version: 7.13.3 (stable)
build-time: Jan/24/2024 13:16:46
factory-software: 6.40.5
free-memory: 180.3MiB
total-memory: 256.0MiB
cpu: ARM
cpu-count: 4
cpu-frequency: 448MHz
cpu-load: 0%
free-hdd-space: 164.0KiB
total-hdd-space: 15.2MiB
write-sect-since-reboot: 12876
write-sect-total: 4158636
architecture-name: arm
board-name: hAP ac^2
platform: MikroTik

> system/package/print
Columns: NAME, VERSION
# NAME VERSION
0 routeros 7.13.3
1 wireless 7.13.3

Thu Jan 25, 2024 11:18 pm

Maybe, maybe not.
Remove wifi-qcom-ac package.
Reboot
Add 7.12.2 package on Files
System/packages downgrade

Thu Jan 25, 2024 11:26 pm

Upgraded Audience from 7.12.1 (with wifiwave2) to 7.13.3. Overall, upgrade went smooth, with the only exception that the wifi3 interface in the station-bridge mode refused to connect to my AP (running on channel 163, i.e., 5745/ac/Ceee) until I explicitly specified the country (on the station!)

Why the hell would the country-related changes affect the stations (i.e., Mikrotiks as wireless clients)?

Thu Jan 25, 2024 11:29 pm

Probably this change since 7.13.1:

*) wifi - use "Latvia" as default value for "country" property;

Thu Jan 25, 2024 11:31 pm

Yeah, that's clear. But why should it have any effect on the client interfaces?

Thu Jan 25, 2024 11:38 pm

Just a guess from my side:
that fix/correction/change was implemented (I can think of some cases where leaving country blank can get wrong situations for some countries) but someone got a bit too eager and went a step too far. It's not needed indeed for client connections IMHO.
But I could be very wrong here too.

Dario1982 · Thu Jan 25, 2024 11:40 pm

Issue on LEDs not working on SXT LTE6 still persist on 7.13.3

bpwl · Thu Jan 25, 2024 11:40 pm

"Why the hell would the country-related changes affect the stations (i.e., Mikrotiks as wireless clients)?"

TX power allowed changes with Country and ROS version. Change between versions can be dramatic. Eg Europe for 5745+ freq from 30dB to 16dB
Stations have also to conform the EIRP transmission levels. Some freq are just not allowed
So yes country setting is important. It will probably also limit the scanned frequencies for the stations.

Thu Jan 25, 2024 11:43 pm

@bpwl
if a MT device connects as client, it needs to observe the frequency of the AP, no ?
Or is this merely for the scanning part where it looks for the AP ?

bpwl · Thu Jan 25, 2024 11:56 pm

The station always follows the AP in frequency. What range to scan could be defined by country (optimised).
The TX power of the station is important , is set by Country value (and antenna gain correction parameter)
AFAIK the AP is the only one that has to do the CAC test for radars. Not the station. Sometimes the swap of both in PtP is interesting for false radar detect avoidance.

bpwl · Fri Jan 26, 2024 12:00 am

Probably this change since 7.13.1:
*) wifi - use "Latvia" as default value for "country" property;

And I have seen some long lists in this forum of the power limits in earlier but recent ROS versions for the wifiwave2.
The limits where quite different (much higher) than the current values.

pomah · Fri Jan 26, 2024 12:22 am

Hi guys, I have upgraded my setup but for some reason I can not update my CAP AC2 to the qcom-ac package, I have done just like in the mikrotik yourube viode, draged it into files and rebooted, but everytime my cap boots up the file is gone but ther is still the old wireless package?

gammy69er · Fri Jan 26, 2024 1:15 am

Hi guys, I have upgraded my setup but for some reason I can not update my CAP AC2 to the qcom-ac package, I have done just like in the mikrotik yourube viode, draged it into files and rebooted, but everytime my cap boots up the file is gone but ther is still the old wireless package?

You need to go to packages and "uninstall" the wireless package.
You can then drop the new AC package on and reboot - it will uninstall wireless and install wifi.

DISCLAIMER - I have only done this on hAP AC2 and on 7.13.1 and 7.13.2 - the process "should" be exactly the same with the same result (presuming H/W Support)

gammy69er · Fri Jan 26, 2024 1:24 am

Just 2 cents here

Upgrade appears to be fine for me. 7.13.2 - 7.13.3

hAP AX3
PoE Out to Uplink AP (Loco AC - 24v PSU)
Router with vlans for WAN - PPPoE with backup DHCP (same source - different Subnets)
Wireguard VPN with OSPF on top - WG re-established and OSPF working (filtered as required - but showing filterd routes)
Wifi Working
No Bridge STP - H/W Offload Functional on individual ports.
added Bonded Interface to Switch - also still functioning (802.3ad)

Nothing more to add at this time.

pomah · Fri Jan 26, 2024 9:30 am

Hi guys, I have upgraded my setup but for some reason I can not update my CAP AC2 to the qcom-ac package, I have done just like in the mikrotik yourube viode, draged it into files and rebooted, but everytime my cap boots up the file is gone but ther is still the old wireless package?
You need to go to packages and "uninstall" the wireless package.
You can then drop the new AC package on and reboot - it will uninstall wireless and install wifi.

DISCLAIMER - I have only done this on hAP AC2 and on 7.13.1 and 7.13.2 - the process "should" be exactly the same with the same result (presuming H/W Support)

Funny, in the youtube he jsut drops the new wifi package and reboots, that is what I have been doing, but I'll try to remove the old one first :)

sjoukes · Fri Jan 26, 2024 3:33 pm

Multiple RB5009 still reboot at random with 7.13.3.
Services used:
WireGuard
OpenVPN Server
OpenVPN Client
L2TP Server
DHCP Server
Multiple VLAN's for guest en company network.
IGMP Proxy
IPv4 & IPv6
PPoE (MTU1500) 2.5gbit uplink via VLAN + Modified MTU on VLAN + ethx interface.
10Gbit DAC link on SFP+ interface to LAN switch
NTP Client
Firewalls + NAT + Mangle rules + Address Lists + 100+ static DNS entries
Queues for QoS.
NoWLAN
FastPath and FastForward enabled.
Multiple Bridges + RSTP + VLAN

7.12.1 remains stable with an identical configuration.

Ovic · Fri Jan 26, 2024 3:49 pm

Mine exibits the same behaviour since upgrade to 7.13.3. Reverted to 7.13.2 as it was running stable for 9 days.

herbrico · Fri Jan 26, 2024 4:22 pm

Hi to all. In my case RB1100AHx4DE,RBM33G,RB2011,Groove52 and Netmetal AC2 work most stable on 7.13 and 7.13.3. I'm on the version 7.13.3 now. On version 7.13.1 and 7.13.2 DOH does not work properly and autosupout file is constantly generated.

defrag · Sat Jan 27, 2024 1:40 pm

Hi folks, have updated my hAP ac² from 7.13.2 to 7.13.3 and an error message «script error: error - contact MikroTik support and send a supout file (2)» is still there. I did netinstall to 7.13.0 due to insufficient disk space when switching to wifi-qcom-ac package and then skipped 7.13.1 updating directly to 7.13.2 where I saw this error for the first time. I haven't seen this error after updating from 7.12 to 7.13.0 (with the legacy wifi package)
No issues in the functional area were detected, though.

memelchenkov · Sat Jan 27, 2024 11:07 pm

Not a good update, now there are many messages "reassociating", "disconnected, ok" in wifi logs.

syadnom · Sun Jan 28, 2024 12:37 am

Can we please get this fetch info default out? this doesn't belong, I choose when to add fetch, I can choose when to log it, instead I have to negate it. Please remove this when output=none is set.

pe1chl · Sun Jan 28, 2024 11:37 am

That is just a special case of the problems in the logging system in general. It really needs to be worked on.
Long ago I have submitted a ticket for that, and it was agreed that it needs work, but nothing has happened since.
(as Jotne also rightfully complains about)

jirinovak · Sun Jan 28, 2024 10:59 pm

I tested this version on my CCR 1016 where MPLS and VPLS {LDP} is running. After 3 to 5 minutes router reboots and it keeps repating over and over. On version 7.12.1 everything is ok. Has anyone same experience? No error in log.
I have a similar problem, on devices using MPLS/VPLS I see kernel panics every few hours and a lot of problems with packets not being forwarded or routed properly. I have seen it on an RB4011 (arm), RB5009 (arm64), and CCR1009 (tile). No supout generated, just a log message about the router being improperly rebooted and a suggestion that a kernel panic might be the reason.

Yesterday, I upgraded again but now to 7.13.3 and everything with vpls is ok 👍

mistercovert · Mon Jan 29, 2024 9:24 pm

After finally getting DOH working on my hAP AX lite, having downloading numerous certificates, I did a full clean config and I have got the router connecting to Cloudflare, but occasionally I get the following error messages in my log

DoH server connection error: Idle timeout - connecting
DoH server connection error: Idle timeout - connecting [ignoring repeated messages]

DNS seems to be connecting OK, I have only put 10GB through the router since I set the new config this morning. Is anyone else getting these error messages?

Valerio5000 · Mon Jan 29, 2024 9:39 pm

maybe I found a bug...

Hap Ac2 with Winbox on Windows I set a "signal range" in the Access List. Nothing appears on Winbox for Android, the field is empty. ROS 7.13.3, and Winbox in both systems is the latest version available

jaclaz · Tue Jan 30, 2024 1:43 pm

... issue is present on RoS 7.13+ versions, it is recommended to perform a temporary downgrade to RoS 7.12.

Seemingly the meaning of stable according to Mikrotik is exclusively:
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/stable
"not spontaneously radioactive"

Ovic · Tue Jan 30, 2024 1:51 pm

The ovpn issue also impacted me and it occurs at very random times so it was pretty difficult to catch. At least it's good that they got it.

Ullinator · Tue Jan 30, 2024 2:59 pm

Seems we have managed to replicate the issue with the RB5009 oVPN clinet/server hardware encryption causing the router to reboot.
We are working on releasing the fix, as of today, issue is present on RoS 7.13+ versions, it is recommended to perform a temporary downgrade to RoS 7.12.

Are you sure this is limited only to OpenVPN?
I´m asking because I´m also involved in spontanious reboots since 7.13.x (also in 7.14x until Beta8, which seems to be stable) without using OpenVPN. (SUP-136647)
In use is WireGuard and Zerotier on my router, but the instability is also seen on my ARM-based CAP AX.

HamRadio · Wed Jan 31, 2024 3:38 am

Seems we have managed to replicate the issue with the RB5009 oVPN clinet/server hardware encryption causing the router to reboot.
We are working on releasing the fix, as of today, issue is present on RoS 7.13+ versions, it is recommended to perform a temporary downgrade to RoS 7.12.

So is a 7.13.4 release coming with this fix and others? At this point I'd love to see 7.13 turned into an LTS release since we're already 3 releases in, and possibly another one is coming?

peich1 · Wed Jan 31, 2024 4:50 am

Seems we have managed to replicate the issue with the RB5009 oVPN clinet/server hardware encryption causing the router to reboot.
We are working on releasing the fix, as of today, issue is present on RoS 7.13+ versions, it is recommended to perform a temporary downgrade to RoS 7.12.

Finally! Let's hope this is fixed quickly, if possible a 7.13.4 version...

HamRadio · Wed Jan 31, 2024 8:05 pm

It would be cool to maybe backport all the bug-fixes from 7.14, so for us were V7 is "Feature Complete" meaning we don't really need any new features at this point, what we need is stability, then backport just the bug-fixes from 7.14 so we can have a "Stable" 7.13.4 release to land on for awhile while V7 development continues.

tschek · Wed Jan 31, 2024 9:10 pm

After finally getting DOH working on my hAP AX lite, having downloading numerous certificates, I did a full clean config and I have got the router connecting to Cloudflare, but occasionally I get the following error messages in my log

DoH server connection error: Idle timeout - connecting
DoH server connection error: Idle timeout - connecting [ignoring repeated messages]

DNS seems to be connecting OK, I have only put 10GB through the router since I set the new config this morning. Is anyone else getting these error messages?

Hey, yes i got the same issues. Looks like is not fixed yet.... Problem ocurs with 7.13, before was no Probleme

dzievamarcos · Thu Feb 01, 2024 10:26 pm

After finally getting DOH working on my hAP AX lite, having downloading numerous certificates, I did a full clean config and I have got the router connecting to Cloudflare, but occasionally I get the following error messages in my log

DoH server connection error: Idle timeout - connecting
DoH server connection error: Idle timeout - connecting [ignoring repeated messages]

DNS seems to be connecting OK, I have only put 10GB through the router since I set the new config this morning. Is anyone else getting these error messages?
Hey, yes i got the same issues. Looks like is not fixed yet.... Problem ocurs with 7.13, before was no Probleme

I've also had this error and others for a long time, DoH doesn't know how to work without complaining.

hmatmtf · Fri Feb 02, 2024 7:21 am

Ref. https://wiki.mikrotik.com/wiki/Manual:CAPsMAN

Is WPA3 still unsupported by CAPsMAN v2 ?

Fri Feb 02, 2024 8:19 am

You are referring to old documentation:
https://help.mikrotik.com/docs/display/ROS/Wireless

There are 2 versions of capsman depending on the wifi drivers used by AP (and both CM versions can be used on the same controller):
Legacy: no wpa3
wave2: wap3 is supported.

savage · Fri Feb 02, 2024 3:53 pm

It would always be best to adhere to common hostname format standards as system identity translates to hostname of the device.

Then Mikrotik should check that, when setting the identity and not accept spaces (and other characters that doesn't belong there) :)

Amm0 · Fri Feb 02, 2024 5:17 pm

It would always be best to adhere to common hostname format standards as system identity translates to hostname of the device.
Then Mikrotik should check that, when setting the identity and not accept spaces (and other characters that doesn't belong there) :)

It's not "wrong". Space should be encoded by RouterOS downstream if needed by some protocol. Since /system/identity mainly comes up in LLDP/CDP/MMDP – and winbox – I can see why some folks want to have spaces to make things more readable & not sure space violates those specs. And DNS on RouterOS does not use it.

Although I don't use spaces in identify/filenames/ifname/anywhere if I can avoid it (e.g. that's easier than trying to escape/encode special chars in various contexts). I'm still not sure why the underscore _ change was needed:

*) console - replace reserved characters in file and script names with underscores

It kinda limits the usefulness of newer /file/add since you may need to create a file with spaces for container/etc/etc. Like /system/identity, spaces have long been allowed in file names.

masterlyar · Fri Feb 02, 2024 5:26 pm

Seems we have managed to replicate the issue with the RB5009 oVPN clinet/server hardware encryption causing the router to reboot.
We are working on releasing the fix, as of today, issue is present on RoS 7.13+ versions, it is recommended to perform a temporary downgrade to RoS 7.12.

Glad to ear that ! :)

peterda · Sat Feb 03, 2024 1:51 pm

After i upgraded from 7.13.2 to 7.13.3, my IPv6 did not work.
In the log i see error message that Pool "Altibox" does not exist. (not the exact error i do not want to install 7.13.3 again at this point)

The release notes for 7.13.3 do not state changes in IPv6, so it is disturbing that a minor release brakes my IPv6.

This is the exported ipv6 config:

# model = RB760iGS (hEX S)
/ipv6 address
add address=::a55:31ff:fe12:581a eui-64=yes from-pool=Altibox interface=vlan-home
add disabled=yes eui-64=yes from-pool=Altibox interface=vlan-management
add disabled=yes eui-64=yes from-pool=Altibox interface=vlan-guest
add disabled=yes eui-64=yes from-pool=Altibox interface=vlan-dmz
add address=::1 from-pool=Altibox interface=bridge no-dad=yes
/ipv6 dhcp-client
add add-default-route=yes interface=altibox-wan pool-name=Altibox pool-prefix-length=48 request=prefix use-peer-dns=no
/ipv6 firewall filter
# Omitted for brevity.
/ipv6 nd
add disabled=yes interface=bridge ra-interval=20s-1m
/ipv6 settings
set max-neighbor-entries=8192

I will try to fix the configuration to be 7.13.3 compliant (is that a thing?) by adding an /ipv6 pool config.
Have other here on the forum experienced the same or do i have a misconfiguration that was fixed in 7.13.3, please comment.

A little update about the issue.
/ipv6 pool is added dynamically which is not the case in 7.13.3

[.....@RBR-001] /ipv6/pool> pr
Flags: D - DYNAMIC
Columns: NAME, PREFIX, PREFIX-LENGTH, EXPIRES-AFTER
# NAME PREFIX PREFIX-LENGTH EXPIRES-AFTER
0 D Altibox 2a01:563:5b:e300::/56 64 4h11m28s

Regards, Peter

pe1chl · Sat Feb 03, 2024 5:35 pm

Did you run into this issue when trying to configure the router from an export, or when just rebooting it after the upgrade?
There is this bug in the /export that it exports /ipv6 address before /ipv6 dhcp-client, but it has been like that for longer than 7.13.3 and it usually seems harmless.
Could it be that your IPv6 dhcp-client could not obtain a prefix? (e.g. ISP was temporarily unreachable)

vecernik87 · Sun Feb 04, 2024 1:59 am

One of my hAP ac2 running v7.13.2 had an interesting and totally unwanted behavior earlier today:

VPNs went down (thats how I noticed)
config in winbox looked wrong (e.g. ovpn server was showing not enabled and port set to "1")
couldn't make export - the "in progress" file got stuck around 173Bytes and didn't progress further even though there was alegedly free space.
trying to disable/enable some interfaces produced an error about "program not responding"
reboot took several minutes before the device went off.

I can only assume it was due to low space, as discussed in the testing/RC thread. My router is in production and is not using any test version. It was running with basic "wireless" package which was installed during regular package update to v7.13 I did not manually install the larger "wifi-qcom-ac" package. There are also no extra packages and files on the router at all. Although the config is largest of my devices, it isn't anything extreme - only 54kB when exported (we are not talking about thousands or even hundreds of connections. There are only 10 networks and 10 VPNs connected with perhaps 100 firewall rules)

The router was reporting about 3% free space (so not totally full). If this is going to happen to everyone on normal install, we are getting into interesting times. As this device is in production environment, my quick bandaid was to uninstall the wireless package completely and rely on wired connection only - that won't be a solution for everyone. I am curious if this will occur on other devices and if more customers will report the same here.

foraster · Sun Feb 04, 2024 11:43 am

Regarding hap ac2 lack of space, mikrotik could partition the router OS main package into smaller packages (again) and let the user choose the functions he wants to install.

Another -probably more unsecure- option could be allowing packages to be installed on external storage, and yes I know we already can have our backups saved on usb.

The design process of the package system seems erratic to me, first all the system and packages in a single monolithic package, then splitting the wireless to allow arm owners to use new wifi (wifiwave2), lots of cap acs and hap ac2s out there to leave them practically unusable when you need some (not all) extra functions, don't you think?

pe1chl · Sun Feb 04, 2024 12:21 pm

One of my hAP ac2 running v7.13.2 had an interesting and totally unwanted behavior earlier today:

The router was reporting about 3% free space (so not totally full). If this is going to happen to everyone on normal install, we are getting into interesting times.

Yes, in particular the hAP ac2 is in trouble, and MikroTik is in denial.
It will be interesting indeed... we will have to see what comes out of it.
It seems they were able to squeeze some space in the latest 7.14 beta. I would recommend remaining on 7.12.2 (so before the wireless changes) at least until 7.14.1 is released (and follow the release topic to see how things are).

laurinkus · Sun Feb 04, 2024 2:58 pm

Yes, in particular the hAP ac2 is in trouble, and MikroTik is in denial.
It will be interesting indeed... we will have to see what comes out of it.
It seems they were able to squeeze some space in the latest 7.14 beta. I would recommend remaining on 7.12.2 (so before the wireless changes) at least until 7.14.1 is released (and follow the release topic to see how things are).

Not exactly true. Every 7.14 version requires more and more free space.

Package sizes:

11 435 632 Jan  8 11:43 routeros-7.13.1-arm.npk
11 431 544 Jan 15 11:16 routeros-7.13.2-arm.npk
11 423 348 Jan 25 11:19 routeros-7.13.3-arm.npk

11 591 276 Jan 11 10:16 routeros-7.14beta6-arm.npk
11 611 760 Jan 16 11:13 routeros-7.14beta7-arm.npk
11 619 964 Jan 23 15:40 routeros-7.14beta8-arm.npk
11 742 852 Feb  2 13:04 routeros-7.14beta9-arm.npk

My hAP ac2 has only 268.0KiB free-hdd-space left. Currently running on 7.13.3 and I'm not sure I will be able to upgrade to 7.14 with that little space.

Not only they're not unbundling optional packages like PPP and Routing, but they also added Rose (SMB) functionality to the main package. IMO smb functionality is also optional and shouldn't be included in the main bundle.

Amm0 · Sun Feb 04, 2024 3:23 pm

100% on more package separation. But...that's not quite fair math between 7.13.3 and 7.14beta8+.

The wireless package is ~500kb smaller in 7.14, so while there is ~320kb increase in main package... 7.14 uses ~180kb less space than 7.13.3 (using same wireless+routeros combo).

templeos · Sun Feb 04, 2024 4:14 pm

The wireless package is ~500kb smaller in 7.14, so while there is ~320kb increase in main package... 7.14 uses ~180kb less space than 7.13.3 (using same wireless+routeros combo).

Gains are meaningless if you immediately lose those gains if you want to use wifi-qcom-ac. Because that package is just as big. Combine that with 7.14beta9 RouterOS main pacakge and you can see that the situation is not great.

peterda · Sun Feb 04, 2024 8:36 pm

Did you run into this issue when trying to configure the router from an export, or when just rebooting it after the upgrade?
There is this bug in the /export that it exports /ipv6 address before /ipv6 dhcp-client, but it has been like that for longer than 7.13.3 and it usually seems harmless.
Could it be that your IPv6 dhcp-client could not obtain a prefix? (e.g. ISP was temporarily unreachable)

I did an upgrade via the package menu in winbox.
And no it was not the case that i could not uptain a prefix.
I downgraded to 7.13 and testet up to 7.13.2 that it was working.
The ISP was reachable i was connected with IPv4 all the time.

If i can afford the downtime, i will do an upgrade and test with 7.13.3

vecernik87 · Mon Feb 05, 2024 12:29 am

@foraster:

Regarding hap ac2 lack of space, mikrotik could partition the router OS main package into smaller packages (again) and let the user choose the functions he wants to install.

I don't believe so. It has been already explained that separating packages creates a lot of overhead - wasted space. I also think that it isn't best approach to force users to uninstall feature, just so they can use a device they recently purchased. hAP ac2 isn't even legacy/EOL. New units are is still for sale so new users will face similar situation more and more often.

The design process of the package system seems erratic to me, ... don't you think?

Absolutely agree. IMHO best would be to start releasing RoS based on device model (not architecture) thus saving a LOT of space due to removal of extra drivers, which are at the moment bundled together. That could give second breath to devices with limited space.

@pe1chl:

MikroTik is in denial.

Hopefully not for long. Thats why I am reporting it as a bug in this topic and not in RC/testing topic. This is IMHO no longer issue for a few individuals who are trying to add additional packages. This is becoming widespread and mikrotik surely understands the damage to reputation it could create if it gets more common and and starts getting media attention. I just hope they will approach it reasonably and not solve it by EOLing all devices with limited space. I have another device with ~50kB config which I assume will play up soon-ish but is in less critical spot so I might let it become unstable and then ask support@ for their opinion, if there is no staff answer here.

I would recommend remaining on 7.12.2 (so before the wireless changes) at least until 7.14.1 is released

Good point. TBH, I don't think there will be some magic in 7.14+ which suddenly gives us lot of extra space. That is unavoidable consequence of adding more and more features.

Amm0 · Mon Feb 05, 2024 2:46 am

It has been already explained that separating packages creates a lot of overhead

Well, the "overhead" in packaging has to be less then 17kb... since that the size of the lora.npk (which has code for LoRaWAN too).

pe1chl · Mon Feb 05, 2024 11:03 am

I would recommend remaining on 7.12.2 (so before the wireless changes) at least until 7.14.1 is released
Good point. TBH, I don't think there will be some magic in 7.14+ which suddenly gives us lot of extra space. That is unavoidable consequence of adding more and more features.

There appears to be some extra space in the latest 7.14beta versions, at least on the hAP ac2.
I.e. people write about that. I did not yet try to install it.

The point of splitting into separate packages of course is so that "more and more features" would not increase the size of the base package all the time, so everyone can decide which features they most require and install only those.

Unfortunately MikroTik denies that all those extra features consume all that extra space. E.g. all the auto routing protocols used to be in a (single) separate package and that seems a good candidate to separate as home users are not using those.
But suggesting to do that again results in dumb remarks like "without the routing package you would not have routing".

infabo · Mon Feb 05, 2024 11:50 am

I don't believe that routing protocols significantly increase the size of the main package or are easy to separate. The biggest impact comes from binary files. There are some with significant size and not everybody needs. dot1x (100k), lcdstat (212k), quickset (136k), smb (168k in 7.13.3), upnp (108k), wproxy (140k). And then there also a lot of drivers in the main package that are not needed for running a e.g. "Chateau LTE12". Extract that additional drivers into drivers extra package). Then also separate the wifi-qcom-ac package based on the chipset, or at least only install the chipset-relevant firmware/drivers from the package onto the flash. And suddenly we would see like at least 2MB free space on 16MB flash devices.

And fun facts:
The main package even contain files not relevant for them. e.g. under "/home/web/help/zerotier.txt" is lying around a license textfile for zerotier. com'on - zerotier is a separate package. put that license file to that package. Really.

pe1chl · Mon Feb 05, 2024 2:32 pm

When it really is not possible to gain space by separating the packages, a "RouterOS lite" base package could be created that omits all those bells and whistles and allows the device to be used as a simple NAT router without capabilities like auto routing, mpls, dot1x, proxy, SMB, hotspot, etc.
For the dense: with auto routing removed, it should still be able to have connected routes and a default route set manually or via DHCP/PPPoE.
Even when all of them require little space, in total it should result in a size reduction. Whether or not the removed functions are then offered as separate packages or not at all is a decision to be made by the developers.
At least it would make routers like hAP ac2 again usable for the home user. E.g. I use one only as an AP/switch and it is in bridge mode, I do not require all the bells and whistles on that device, I have a 4011 as main router.

infabo · Mon Feb 05, 2024 2:40 pm

Perfectly agree on this. Creating a "main package LITE" is easier (and it certainly is) than splitting up into different packages. Then this should be considered.

mt99 · Mon Feb 05, 2024 5:43 pm

I don't see much evidence that Mikrotik is taking this storage space issue seriously. But they have to do something for devices that can't run v6 and are still being sold, because they have guaranteed a minimum of 5 years support. Whether they break out monolithic packages, come up with a "lite" version, or declare a long-term that works for 16 MB devices, or even a mix of approaches, I don't see how they can avoid bumping this up on the priority list for much longer.

infabo · Mon Feb 05, 2024 6:41 pm

The device includes free software updates for the life of the product or a minimum of 5 years starting from date of purchase..

As long as updates are coming, they are free. This could mean for ROS v6, MT may limit these updates to security updates only. Statement fulfilled.

nmt1900 · Mon Feb 05, 2024 6:51 pm

Almost all Mikrotik switches have the same 16 MB of storage and most of them are arm devices - and now they are coming out with v7 on them. Last bunch of 326 and 328-24P switches I received had 7.11.3 on them from factory. Mikrotik seems to be painting itself into a corner if some fundamental change is not coming in software packaging...

mkx · Mon Feb 05, 2024 8:04 pm

Switches are not a problem, ROS 7.13.2 running on ARM (hAP ac2) without any wireless package uses around 12.2MB storage (switches should be fine without any optional packages).
Problem are all ARM wireless devices with 16MB flash.

nmt1900 · Mon Feb 05, 2024 8:43 pm

Switches are not a problem when you remove wireless package, but by default you end up with routeros and wireless packages after getting to 7.13 with your upgrades. Would be interesting to see, which packages would be installed on switches from factory when they come out with 7.13+

pe1chl · Mon Feb 05, 2024 9:32 pm

Problem are all ARM wireless devices with 16MB flash.

And even worse: 15.3MB Flash

bratislav · Tue Feb 06, 2024 3:26 pm

I don't believe that routing protocols significantly increase the size of the main package or are easy to separate. The biggest impact comes from binary files. There are some with significant size and not everybody needs. dot1x (100k), lcdstat (212k), quickset (136k), smb (168k in 7.13.3), upnp (108k), wproxy (140k). And then there also a lot of drivers in the main package that are not needed for running a e.g. "Chateau LTE12". Extract that additional drivers into drivers extra package). Then also separate the wifi-qcom-ac package based on the chipset, or at least only install the chipset-relevant firmware/drivers from the package onto the flash. And suddenly we would see like at least 2MB free space on 16MB flash devices.

And fun facts:
The main package even contain files not relevant for them. e.g. under "/home/web/help/zerotier.txt" is lying around a license textfile for zerotier. com'on - zerotier is a separate package. put that license file to that package. Really.

In 7.13.3 arm npk route binary is actually the largest one, it is so huge at 541k compressed (1.4M unpacked) that I am pretty sure it contains linked in some kind of routing daemons to support OSPF, BGP, RIP etc... and although separating those daemons probably would not be an easy task it makes sense on smaller devices or switches that would never participate in a dynamic routing.
But yeah binaries like lcdstat not only take space but are pretty useless, last router I had that had LCD was RB3011 and since lcdstat used about 5% of CPU I decided to just switch it off, and I am not aware of any newer ARM device that even has the LCD... I never used wproxy on MT devices and I doubt many people did especially on smaller devices... and SMB should have never been included on routers IMHO... also bundled packages like hotspot that are not part of the main build should be easily removable.

So yeah it seems to me that if there is a will there's a way for MT to shrink the base package.

infabo · Tue Feb 06, 2024 3:55 pm

In 7.13.3 arm npk route binary is actually the largest one, it is so huge at 541k compressed (1.4M unpacked) that I am pretty sure it contains linked in some kind of routing daemons to support OSPF, BGP, RIP etc...

I saw the binary size. This is a probably a big monolithic binary aka "god binary". Quite likely this is the reason why pe1chl suggestion to move some "exotic"/"advanced" routing protocols to some extra package is declined (like seen here: viewtopic.php?p=1049937#p1049937). Maybe the "smartest poster" did already know that there exists some hurdles....:D

mkx · Tue Feb 06, 2024 9:34 pm

In 7.13.3 arm npk route binary is actually the largest one, it is so huge at 541k compressed (1.4M unpacked) that I am pretty sure it contains linked in some kind of routing daemons to support OSPF, BGP, RIP etc... and although separating those daemons probably would not be an easy task it makes sense on smaller devices or switches that would never participate in a dynamic routing.

I'm pretty sure most of smaller devices won't see any of routing protocols. And for static routes linux doesn't need to run any daemons. So why split the route binary, just move the whole of it (and accompanying minor things) to a separate package. And those who want/need to participate in any kind of dynamic routing environment will install this package. After carefully considering if they really want to do it with devices with tiny flash.

Tue Feb 06, 2024 10:15 pm

And for static routes linux doesn't need to run any daemons.

It still needs some user-land program to manage static routes, and I strongly suspect they put everything routing into a single binary.

mkx · Tue Feb 06, 2024 11:11 pm

And for static routes linux doesn't need to run any daemons.
It still needs some user-land program to manage static routes, and I strongly suspect they put everything routing into a single binary.

If they did it, then it was a poor design decission.

Paternot · Tue Feb 06, 2024 11:42 pm

If they did it, then it was a poor design decission.

It all boils down to space. Each package have its own overhead. The question is: "does the package overhead is bigger or smaller than the space we save breaking it up?"

Mikrotik says it's bigger.
I have no idea - but I think they know it better than I. At least, I hope so.

loloski · Wed Feb 07, 2024 12:16 am

it would be best, if they allow the package to be stored and install via external USB or make a ROS lite package as suggested by others here, our HAPAC2 CPE fleet would surely welcome this change if this happen :)

pe1chl · Wed Feb 07, 2024 12:32 am

The question is: "does the package overhead is bigger or smaller than the space we save breaking it up?"

No, that is not the question. The question is if we can have a useful subset of RouterOS functionality plus one or more extensions, which still fits in the flash memory, so the user can choose what functions they want. They cannot have everyhing because that would not fit (that is the place we are now), and making the combination of every function slightly larger is not what we worry about.
It may well be that the total size of all functions that we now have is more than it is today, but as long as a useful subset is smaller, that is still a win.
Not everyone wants the same functions, and I think it is quite unlikely that someone who wants SMB or proxy or hotspot or CAPsMAN or a combination of those would also want BGP, OSPF and IS-IS. Those generally are different use cases.

Panbambaryla · Wed Feb 07, 2024 12:52 am

Let's ask then Mikrotik to prepare modular ROS version 8.

mkx · Wed Feb 07, 2024 8:37 am

If they did it, then it was a poor design decission.
It all boils down to space. Each package have its own overhead. The question is: "does the package overhead is bigger or smaller than the space we save breaking it up?"

Mikrotik says it's bigger.
I have no idea - but I think they know it better than I. At least, I hope so.

It's not only about package overhead, it's also (or mostly) about which package combination is most likely to be installed on a space-constrained device. If we're talking about hAP ac2, then the most likely combination will be wifi (either type) and perhaps zerotier. Not dynamic routing protocols. So if splitting routing into two parts (static + protocols) means that 1.4MB monolithic binary gets split into 200kB (for static routes) + 1.3MB (routing protocols), it's still huge gain (1.2MB) for cases I named. If OTOH routing protocols are needed on a CRS (with small flash), then yes routing in total might use 1.5MB (instead of 1.4MB), but then wireless packages likely won't be necessary which saves a ton of flash space again, so that extra 100kB usage won't be a problem.

When installing such "bloated" split packages on devices with decent amount of flash (64MB +), those few 100kB of bloat won't be problem. For devices with tight flash sizes it's not possible to install all optional packages already now, so arguing that further splitting packages makes installation of many packages is moot.

Wed Feb 07, 2024 5:38 pm

What's new in 7.13.4 (2024-Feb-07 11:59):

*) bridge - avoid per-VLAN host flushing on HW offloaded bridge (introduced in v7.13);
*) defconf - fixed firewall rule for IPv6 UDP traceroute;
*) leds - fixed modem LED indication for SXT LTE 3-7 (introduced in v7.13);
*) lte - fixed Simcom modem support in 0x9000; 0x9002, 0x9002; 0x901a and 0x901b USB compositions (introduced in v7.13);
*) ovpn - improved system stability when using HW encryption on ARM64 devices (introduced in v7.13);
*) route-filter - fixed AS path matchers when input and output chains are used;

mseidler · Wed Feb 07, 2024 5:55 pm

Updated RB3011, CRS317 and WPA ac without any problems

ksteink · Wed Feb 07, 2024 6:07 pm

Does this fix the random reboots of the RB5009?

flapviv · Wed Feb 07, 2024 6:29 pm

Does this fix the random reboots of the RB5009?

I have 2 rb5009 and they never reboot with 7.13.3.
It would be interesting to identify what is the source of those reboots (vpn, routing).

homerouter · Wed Feb 07, 2024 6:38 pm

What is this:

bridge - avoid per-VLAN host flushing on HW offloaded bridge (introduced in v7.13)

ksteink · Wed Feb 07, 2024 7:23 pm

Does this fix the random reboots of the RB5009?
I have 2 rb5009 and they never reboot with 7.13.3.
It would be interesting to identify what is the source of those reboots (vpn, routing).

That's precisely my question! I rolled back all my managed devices to version 7.12.x until I see this firmware version fixed the random reboots. I use a lot of VPNs so for me is a non-go if this issue is not addressed with this new release.

k2dI5umrD9VO · Wed Feb 07, 2024 8:37 pm

remkolodder · Wed Feb 07, 2024 9:28 pm

What's new in 7.13.4 (2024-Feb-07 11:59):

*) ovpn - improved system stability when using HW encryption on ARM64 devices (introduced in v7.13);

Does this mean that the reboots mentioned by a few others after your post, are resolved? It would be interesting to see more about that.
Or would that get tagged as 'system'? I would kindly like to ask you to refer to that in case it would resolve that or attempts to address that.

Ovic · Wed Feb 07, 2024 9:48 pm

Mikrotik's devs already stated that reboots on RB5009 where caused by ovpn. So if you were affected by that, upgrade to 7.13.4.
The fact that others were not impacted is pretty irrelevant. Mine also ran on 7.13.2 for 10 days and then reboots appeared.

remkolodder · Wed Feb 07, 2024 11:37 pm

But Ovic, I get what you are saying, it would be interesting to know whether indeed those reboots are likely fixed on 7.13.4 or not.
When I upgraded to 7.13, it felt like a beta-tester environment. While working from home, I suddenly lost my connection a couple of times, during meetings etc.
I would not be happily trying this again without having at least a feeling that this might just have fixed it. The changelog is too vague for that i.m.o. (yes I can read, and I can read between the lines, and yes it likely addresses it, but there could also be more issues that I am not aware of that got addressed here instead).

Jotne · Thu Feb 08, 2024 8:37 am

@ MikroTik
Why do 6.49.13 get a new thread, but not 7.13.4?
I do not see why. It's much better with a new thread for every stable/long-term version.

Maggiore81 · Thu Feb 08, 2024 8:49 am

Just my two cents on the package system in the MT units:
I suggest a combined package that contains the "old way" featuring systems:

dhcp
ppp
system
security
ipv6

A basic package that can do DHCP, NAT, firewall, SSH (security), IPv6 on board, and some basic tools (traceroute ip scan etc).
The we add separately:
a) wireless (the biggest package)
b) dynamic routing (BGP, OSPF, MPLS etc)
c) zerotier etc, are already in separate packages.
d) storage sytems, they should be in separate packages, they have NO relationship to a basic router device.

We use HAP ac2 as wireless routers, so we use basic+wireless qcom. We really dont need there dynamic routing, storage drivers etc.
The space, as we know, is very limited. Large configurations are out of questions.
I dont support the all monolythic configuration, even if all the new devices are coming with large storage. I think that the approach is wrong since the users are all it guys.

We really should have a BASIC package, not a lite package what will make confusion for the less experts... however we have to keep in mind that MT is not like tplink or dlink for the casual home user... we SHOULD know what are we doing, so having a device with a BASIC system where we add the required package should be a must!
All that is not there, will not broke! Less attack surface, less RAM involved, less processes in memory.

Ovic · Thu Feb 08, 2024 9:23 am

@remkolodder I've upgraded to 7.13.4 and we shall see how it goes, as I have ovpn client running on my router. So far only 15h of uptime since upgrade.

hmatmtf · Thu Feb 08, 2024 9:53 am

My comments and questions are here:
viewtopic.php?t=204183

herbrico · Thu Feb 08, 2024 10:15 am

Hello all. I don't know how it is with you, but I have a problem with version 7.13.4. DNS works much slower, there is buffering on Telemach-EON tv, netflix has delay by 2-3 sec to load content, web pages load slower, i downgrade to 7.13.3 and now is all works ok.

erlinden · Thu Feb 08, 2024 12:12 pm

I don't see that behavior, @herbrico. Looking at the changelog I would not expect differences. Do you have anything configured related to the changelog?

herbrico · Thu Feb 08, 2024 1:03 pm

No nothing related to the changlog. As a rule, there should be no difference. But on my router RB1100AHx4DE dns works as if you sit in Ferrari on 7.13.3 and on 7.13.4 like sit in Ford fiesta.As an example of the time it takes to download 7.13.3 all packages on 7 13.3 is about 2 seconds on 7.13.3, and about 1 minute on 7.13.4.

erlinden · Thu Feb 08, 2024 1:05 pm

Can you please share your config? Really curious if there is anything that could give a hint.

infabo · Thu Feb 08, 2024 1:15 pm

When you say "2 seconds" vs "1 minute" to "download all packages" (i understand: all_packages.zip) from download.mikrotik.com, then you either have a slow DNS that takes ages to resolve the domain download.mikrotik.com - or you dont have a DNS issue at all. And the issue lies elsewhere.

mkx · Thu Feb 08, 2024 1:24 pm

Today MT sites are slow for me, e.g. downloading PDF (a few MB brochure) takes ages. Forum keeps asking me to log in. Some other sites work just fine. And I'm not running 7.13.4. So what gives?

gigabyte091 · Thu Feb 08, 2024 1:30 pm

Hello all. I don't know how it is with you, but I have a problem with version 7.13.4. DNS works much slower, there is buffering on Telemach-EON tv, netflix has delay by 2-3 sec to load content, web pages load slower, i downgrade to 7.13.3 and now is all works ok.

Hey there, I'm running same IPTV as you and can't see any problems (RB5009 on 7.13.4 and Adguard DNS container) but yes, Mikrotik site and forum are slow for me too... Forum keeps asking me to log in and had trouble posting something, I got 500 error in browser

Mesquite · Thu Feb 08, 2024 4:47 pm

@Edpa @Strods I see in 7.14.4 this --> *) bridge - avoid per-VLAN host flushing on HW offloaded bridge (introduced in v7.13);

Should I be moving to 7.13.4 right away since I use bridge vlan filtering...............or put another way, how serious is this bug?

nmt1900 · Thu Feb 08, 2024 5:48 pm

Not all devices are able to do HW offloading when bridge VLAN filtering is enabled - so there might not be a definitive answer to this exact question...