I have an rbm11g ros 7.17.2 and an EM160gl which have been working very well for years. But now the bts in the area are upgrading to 5G and I need a suitable m2 modem that can do aggregation on most 5g bands (I have 2bands 5g n28 n78 and 4 lte bands B1 B3 B20 B28 available for now) what is on the market, compatable from the most expensive to the cheapest?
PS I know that a new ATL5G is boiling in the pot... but by now the wait is wearing me out and there are no rumours or definite news.
Re: Which is the best 5G modem compatible with RoS7.
Not sure whether it is "the best" one but I do successfully use Quectel RM520NGLAA (be careful to obtain the AA version as the USB interface is disabled on the ..AP one). And a Telit FN990-A28 is waiting in the box to be tested once an adaptor arrives - it is based on the same Qualcomm chipset, just the AT commands differ.
Re: Which is the best 5G modem compatible with RoS7.
hello sindy ,
I read a bit the specifications of the 2 modems but I didn't understand if they can do at least 2CA+n78 yours does ?
I read a bit the specifications of the 2 modems but I didn't understand if they can do at least 2CA+n78 yours does ?
- As for the quectel I also found the european variant which seems to be more suitable RM520NEUDA-M20-SGASA(what do you think).
- As for the telit it is not clear if it is supported by ros, but very nice because it is very powerful 29dbm!.
Re: Which is the best 5G modem compatible with RoS7.
This is what I saw in the office the other day:
So 3 bands aggregated, one of them n78.
In a more rural area where the device has been deployed permanently, still 3 bands aggregated but no n78 cell available:
I think nothing about the EUropean variant as I never tested it, nor do I know what DA means in terms of feature limitations.
I am going to test the Telit as soon as I get enough material to plug it in, but in the past, a friend of mine worked hard with Mikrotik to debug support for the previous model of 5G Telit. So chances are fair.
Code: Select all
primary-band: B1@20Mhz earfcn: 100 phy-cellid: abc
ca-band: n78@80Mhz earfcn: 644640 phy-cellid: def
B3@15Mhz earfcn: 1404 phy-cellid: ghiIn a more rural area where the device has been deployed permanently, still 3 bands aggregated but no n78 cell available:
Code: Select all
primary-band: B20@10Mhz earfcn: 6300 phy-cellid: cba
ca-band: n3@10Mhz earfcn: 362650 phy-cellid: fed
B1@20Mhz earfcn: 100 phy-cellid: ighI am going to test the Telit as soon as I get enough material to plug it in, but in the past, a friend of mine worked hard with Mikrotik to debug support for the previous model of 5G Telit. So chances are fair.
Re: Which is the best 5G modem compatible with RoS7.
now i'm even more undecided 
,
the quectel appeals to me, the telit I really like for its power in 5g and i'm impatient to see mikrotik's new atl.
I just have to make up my mind on prices, I found the rm502neu for 168€ where did you buy yours?
,the quectel appeals to me, the telit I really like for its power in 5g and i'm impatient to see mikrotik's new atl.
I just have to make up my mind on prices, I found the rm502neu for 168€ where did you buy yours?
Re: Which is the best 5G modem compatible with RoS7.
I have got my 520(GL), not 502(EU), for about $180 from Ali. I've never tried a 502.
Re: Which is the best 5G modem compatible with RoS7.
oops 520 I meant to say
tnx
tnx
Re: Which is the best 5G modem compatible with RoS7.
I've been waiting for some board with M.2 slots, so haven't tested either modem yet. We do use a lot of the LM960 since that has most bands/CA modes of any miniPCIe-based module, so imagine LM990 should also work.hello sindy ,
I read a bit the specifications of the 2 modems but I didn't understand if they can do at least 2CA+n78 yours does ?
- As for the quectel I also found the european variant which seems to be more suitable RM520NEUDA-M20-SGASA(what do you think).
- As for the telit it is not clear if it is supported by ros, but very nice because it is very powerful 29dbm!.
Good news with MBIM is that most modem should work. But an issue comes up what they display for signal in RouterOS, since MBIM is a spec not everyone support all parts (or misintreprete parts). Since they use a lot of Quectel products, RouterOS can read signal and CA and do passthrough with them.
But, for example, for 4G Sierra-based modems only show a "RSSI" via MBIM, which isn't very useful since SINR/RSRP/RSRQ is what you need.
For Telit, Mikrotik added support to read AT#CAINFO via an MBIM AT channel to get signal CA info shown in RouterOS. And quick peak at LM990 manual, it has same AT#CAINFO command, so RouterOS should be able to pick that up. Now, look be a newer AT#CAINFOEXT too - which RouterOS likely does not read, but what RouterOS display for LM990 likely be what manual says for AT#CAINFO.
I guess I won't worry so much about the power specs, the tower will control the power you're using anyway. The cables/antenna/pigtails, and placement, are going to outwiegh most vendor differences. Now bands and CA modes... those do vary. And what RouterOS reports for modem is most important. Why I think limiting yourself to Quectel or Telit is probably wise since they should show the "full" RouterOS signal data (or at least Mikrotik be likely to fix it). But without good signal data you'd have no idea if the modem was doing good or not...
Re: Which is the best 5G modem compatible with RoS7.
tnx Amm0,
i don't have signal problems, it comes very strong, i have a very good 5g 4mimo antenna, i would like to find a modem module (quectel seems the most supported) that doesn't age prematurely and can support all the possible combinations i have in the area. the rm520 recommended by sindy isn't bad at all i'm also looking at an old RM502Q-AE that doesn't seem bad at all 27combos!
i don't have signal problems, it comes very strong, i have a very good 5g 4mimo antenna, i would like to find a modem module (quectel seems the most supported) that doesn't age prematurely and can support all the possible combinations i have in the area. the rm520 recommended by sindy isn't bad at all i'm also looking at an old RM502Q-AE that doesn't seem bad at all 27combos!
Re: Which is the best 5G modem compatible with RoS7.
You'd like be best with Quectel since Mikrotik use them IMO. Given you're looking for long-term compatibility.
I don't think the Quectel vary that much in the -XX part for RouterOS support – but that matters for CA & bands. I trust you've checked cellmapper.com for your area to see the LTE/5G bands and/or looked up what bands your carrier uses first.... then match to the Quectel -XX part you need. TechShip has a good site to search specs across modems.
As time progresses, MBIM has been more standardized and common, which MIkrotik adopted in V7, so compatibility is getting, generally, better. Now adapting M.2 on 5G modems, you do need the right one.
I don't think the Quectel vary that much in the -XX part for RouterOS support – but that matters for CA & bands. I trust you've checked cellmapper.com for your area to see the LTE/5G bands and/or looked up what bands your carrier uses first.... then match to the Quectel -XX part you need. TechShip has a good site to search specs across modems.
As time progresses, MBIM has been more standardized and common, which MIkrotik adopted in V7, so compatibility is getting, generally, better. Now adapting M.2 on 5G modems, you do need the right one.
Re: Which is the best 5G modem compatible with RoS7.
the choice for the modem to combine with mikrotik by now i think i have found it and it is quectel. the problem is finding the right modem among the many proposed by quectel; there are no clear references to the aggregations they can do. ( bts near 4km has 2bands 5g n28 n78 and 4 lte bands B1 B3 B20 B28)
Re: Which is the best 5G modem compatible with RoS7.
the quectel RM502q-ae similar to the module mounted on the chateau 5g ax also looks like a nice modem, but no lists of possible band aggregations can be found, does anyone know them or where to find information?
Re: Which is the best 5G modem compatible with RoS7.
I'd search on the Quectel forums, or perhaps post there. Generally speaking, and very annoying too, the modem makers some kinda NDA or limited access to the manuals and detailed specs. You might be able to find the PDF of hardware guide for it by searching.the quectel RM502q-ae similar to the module mounted on the chateau 5g ax also looks like a nice modem, but no lists of possible band aggregations can be found, does anyone know them or where to find information?
Re: Which is the best 5G modem compatible with RoS7.
This is exactly what I cannot find, i.e. official information on the aggregations of a modem module; in the various forums, few share these essential characteristics, which I have already written about everywhere. Without these, in my opinion, it is like throwing money away. In the quectel datasheets and manuals, they do not even write the wording such as 3 lte+1 5g. 
Re: Which is the best 5G modem compatible with RoS7.
It does work, however, it was not such a smooth ride like with the Quectel.a Telit FN990-A28 is waiting in the box to be tested once an adaptor arrives - it is based on the same Qualcomm chipset, just the AT commands differ.
At first, RouterOS saw it as a USB device but ignored it as a modem. The reason was that the device supports multiple interface configurations and identifies itself by a distinct USB PID for each of them, and RouterOS only "likes" one of them - the one that supports the MBIM interface. To fix that, it was necessary to connect the modem to a PC and change the USB mode setting.
With the correct PID, RouterOS has recognized the device but the device could not connect to the mobile network; the solution was to enable the proper bands as my particular piece came with just B3 and B4 enabled. On the spot where I was testing, B3 signal was not was strong enough, and B4 is not used in my region at all. I had to enable the bands that are actually in use here by means of an AT command - /interface/lte/show-capabilities says band-selection: no.
Even after fixing the above, the fact that Telit is not Mikrotik's preferred supplier still shows up, because /interface/lte/monitor shows much less information than for the RM520N:
Code: Select all
[me@my-rbm33g] > interface/lte/monitor lte2
status: connected
model: FN990A28
revision: 45.00.003
current-operator: xxxxx
current-cellid: xxxxxxxx
phy-cellid: 7
data-class: 5G ENDC
session-uptime: 1h54m18s
imei: 35238xxxxxxxxxx
imsi: xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
uicc: xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
primary-band: B1 earfcn: 100 phy-cellid: 7
rsrp: -93dBm
rsrq: -12dBAnd even though the modem is recognized, no additional serial ports get created, so the gps package of RouterOS cannot attach to anything to receive the NMEA data.
Re: Which is the best 5G modem compatible with RoS7.
when i chose the 4g modem i had no doubts about which one to choose.
the quectel em160gl aggregates almost everything.
now for 5g there's a multitude of modems that leaves me bewildered.
i found this site https://uecapability.smartphonecombo.it/library/ but i can't read it and make comparisons. it's very complicated.
the quectel em160gl aggregates almost everything.
now for 5g there's a multitude of modems that leaves me bewildered.
i found this site https://uecapability.smartphonecombo.it/library/ but i can't read it and make comparisons. it's very complicated.
Re: Which is the best 5G modem compatible with RoS7.
That would have been my expectation. As you note, Mikrotik uses Quectel so does seem a safer choice. But what I'd check is if fireware upgrade is supported on the Quectel you're using — as my main downside to Telit modem is Mikrotik does not support firmware upgrade with them. So if a firmware upgrade is needed, you need to pull the modem out and use a PC with Telit. Now.... whether your Quectel will support firmware upgrade IDK, that might be very model specific even if they generically support.It does work, however, it was not such a smooth ride like with the Quectel.a Telit FN990-A28 is waiting in the box to be tested once an adaptor arrives - it is based on the same Qualcomm chipset, just the AT commands differ.
But if you ask me the biggest downside of any "3rd party" modem is the lack of firmware upgrade support. This remove the modem to upgrade is PITA. The LM960s have been stable in that department without any upgrades for 1-2 years I'd say. Anyway, I've been a happy 4G Telit on Mikrotik customer for a while. Now 5G... IDK, for that we've just not been using Mikrotik, since the lack of FOTA upgrades has been a real problem over the years, and adding the hassle to adapt M.2, and no board with slots are ARM64-based.
Anyway, here is what the LM960 reports for signal. FWIW, I did file a bug in 2021, and after some discussion, they did support for reading Telit's "AT#CAINFO" command which is what gets the data you see I suspect (i.e. Mikroik has support for reading AT to get signal data for SOME modem, "pure" MBIM would report less than what you're seeing for LN990). Now it appears to missing the ca-band, sinr, cqi in your screenshot - those do appear on LM960s. Now that could also be an artifact of monitor "once" may not have a chance to read all the variables. Anyway here is what is reported for LM960, if it helps
Code: Select all
/interface/lte/monitor lte1,lte2
status: connected connected
model: LM960A18 LM960A18
revision: 32.00.148 32.00.128
current-operator: AT&T Verizon
phy-cellid: XXX XXX
data-class: LTE LTE
session-uptime: 6m11s 50s
imei: XXX XXX
imsi: XXX XXX
uicc: XXX XXX
primary-band: B66@10Mhz earfcn: 66986 phy-cellid: XXX B2@10Mhz earfcn: 1150 phy-cellid: 390
ca-band: B2@20Mhz earfcn: 800 phy-cellid: XXX B66@10Mhz earfcn: 67086 phy-cellid: XXX
B66@10Mhz earfcn: 66686 phy-cellid: 400 B13@10Mhz earfcn: 5230 phy-cellid: XXX
cqi: 7 10
rssi: -83dBm -56dBm
rsrp: -116dBm -86dBm
rsrq: -16dB -12dB
sinr: -3dB 11dBNow Mikrotik is using just AT#CAINFO, which you'll see maps to what you see for LN990, with the output varying depending on primary band is LTE or 5G. So if you have a 5G with 2CAs connected, Mikrotik gets this today:
...and dozen other variants, just repeating same info for each CA ...<On NR5G 2CA: PCC + SCC>
#CAINFO:
<band_class>,<nr_channel>,<nr_bandwidth>,<nr_pci>,<nr_rsrp>,<nr_rssi>,<nr_rsrq
>,<nr_sinr>,<tac>,[<tx_power>],<nr_ulmod>,<nr_dlmod>,5G_SCC_0:
<band_class>,<nr_channel>,<nr_bandwidth>,<nr_pci>,<nr_rsrp>,<nr_rssi>,<nr_rsrq
>,<nr_sinr>,<nr_state>,<nr_ulmod>,<nr_dlmod>
Now I suspect the display FN990 is that Mikroitk isn't handling the slightly newer response in AT#CAINFO like the one above from a 5G connection... Since for an LTE connection it look like:
I think Mikrotik expects it to be more CSV-ish, but if you lock 5G looks like there be 5G_SCC_0: marker introduced & that may be breaking support. Mikrotik support is pretty good on these modems. They add the RSRP/etc and CA info for Telit in 2021 based on a bug report. While there is newer AT#CAINFOEXT that has more 5G data, i.e.<On LTE 3CA: PCC + SCC + ENDC>
#CAINFO:
<band_class>,<rx_channel>,<dl_bw>,<pci>,<rsrp>,<rssi>,<rsrq>,<sinr>,<tac>,[<tx_p
ower>],<uplink_modulation>,<downlink_modulation>,<band_class>,<rx_channel>,<
dl_bw>,<pci>,<rsrp>,<rssi>,<rsrq>,<sinr>,<state>,<uplink_modulation>,<downlink_
modulation>
And since I had the manual up, here is the FN990's specs for 5G version in AT#CAINFOEXT
(and other variants, just repeating same info for each CA)#CAINFOEXT: 2, LTE
PCC- BandClass: <band_class>, RX_CH: <rx_channel>, DL_BW:
<dl_bw>, PCI: <pci>, RSRP: <rsrp>, RSSI: <rssi>, RSRQ: <rsrq>,
SINR: <sinr>, TAC: <tac>, [TX_PWR: <tx_power>], UL_MOD:
<uplink_modulation>, DL_MOD: <downlink_modulation>
SCC0- BandClass: <band_class>, RX_CH: <rx_channel>, DL_BW:
<dl_bw>, PCI: <pci>, RSRP: <rsrp>, RSSI: <rssi>, RSRQ: <rsrq>,
SINR: <sinr>, STATE: <state>, UL_MOD: <uplink_modulation>,
DL_MOD: <downlink_modulation>
Since you're forging new ground with FN990, thought I share what I know from now years of using LM960s. (And already had AT manual up so I just cut-and-paste'd in case you open a case).
Re: Which is the best 5G modem compatible with RoS7.
Not so much mine, at least not to that extent, given the effort made at Mikrotik side to make the 960 work back then.That would have been my expectation.
At least for now it is not. So RM520N:FN990 0:0 here.what I'd check is if fireware upgrade is supported on the Quectel you're using
Agreed, but how much down that side is depends on the circumstances. If the MISP refuses to address your bandwidth issues (for a fixed service they have sold you before)* until you switch to 5G, that's an even deeper downside, so you need to do something, even if that means that the modem firmware will not be up to date all the time.if you ask me the biggest downside of any "3rd party" modem is the lack of firmware upgrade support.
* of course, technically I do understand why they want people to switch to more bandwidth-efficient solutions, but still. And a blackbox "5G router" may be even more of a maintenance nightmare than a 3rd party M.2 module.
The USB A on hAP ax³ or one of the indoor 5009s should address this. It doesn't matter much whether you have to interwork the USB from a mPCIe or from a Type A connector, the thicket of antennas is a bigger issue to deal with.adding the hassle to adapt M.2, and no board with slots are ARM64-based.
Log says otherwise - only MBIM is used unless you issue some AT command manually (and unless you specify the SMS protocol to be AT). So my guess would be that the AT#CAINFO is only used for LM960 in particular, not blindly for anything with the Telit VID. Hence I figure what it shows for the FN990 comes from the MBIM messages alone. The last RouterOS changelog the FN990 was mentioned in was the one for 7.7 but at least it indicates that they did give that model some care at all.I did file a bug in 2021, and after some discussion, they did support for reading Telit's "AT#CAINFO" command which is what gets the data you see I suspect (i.e. Mikroik has support for reading AT to get signal data for SOME modem, "pure" MBIM would report less than what you're seeing for LN990).
Hm. Maybe this is the reason why Mikrotik prefers Quectelsince I had the manual up, here is the FN990's specs for 5G version in AT#CAINFOEXT
- my 45.00.003 firmware does not understand AT#CAINFOEXT, but on the upside, the response to AT#CAINFO contains a separate row for 5G ENDC, with about the same fields your manual promises for AT#CAINFOEXT:Code: Select all
#CAINFO: 120,100,5,7,-93,-64,-8,190,0ae2,10,0,0,122,1404,4,495,-93,-74,-3,0,1,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0
ENDC: 28,10,10,152690,141690,-63,-74,-10,370,245,2,0,0,0
Re: Which is the best 5G modem compatible with RoS7.
Fair enough, just seem to cut off where CAINFO would have. Same CAINFO is used the LM940s FWIW. That's actually good news if you're not seeing AT commands. I know later specs provide more data & sound like both Mikrotik and modem use them. MBIM be better than AT for sure. Although it was the missing CA bands in the screenshot, is why I was curious.Log says otherwise - only MBIM is used unless you issue some AT command manually [...] Hence I figure what it shows for the FN990 comes from the MBIM messages alone. The last RouterOS changelog the FN990 was mentioned in was the one for 7.7 but at least it indicates that they did give that model some care at all.
Re: Which is the best 5G modem compatible with RoS7.
Please note RB5009 can only supply 1.5A over its USB-A port - this might not be enough for RM520N running in 5G NSA mode.The USB A on hAP ax³ or one of the indoor 5009s should address this. It doesn't matter much whether you have to interwork the USB from a mPCIe or from a Type A connector, the thicket of antennas is a bigger issue to deal with.
MikroTik only offers DFOTA packages for Quectel modems (and a lone Fibocom FG621). DFOTA packages are incremental (delta) over previous firmware and are prepared by Quectel on request by partner (in this case MikroTik). As such, only modems that MikroTik sells themselves will have support for firmware upgrade and only from firmware versions that they supply (which might not always match general availability firmware version; for example EC200A seem to be a customer specific unit). It is however possible to manually supply DFOTA firmware withwhat I'd check is if fireware upgrade is supported on the Quectel you're using
Code: Select all
firmware-upgrade firmware-file={}Re: Which is the best 5G modem compatible with RoS7.
for the usb power problem, I chose the best way which is to have a Poe powered routerboard (RBM11) but I am unfortunately limited in speed to 480Mb (I would need a routerboard with M2 and 10Gb eth port...) .
As for the firmware update of the modem with the EM160GL I had to use Qfirehose because the very convenient DFOTA commands did not work.
I'm more and more willing to buy the Quectel RM502Q-AE even if old it seems to me the modem with the best aggregations, have you ever heard of it @eider ?
As for the firmware update of the modem with the EM160GL I had to use Qfirehose because the very convenient DFOTA commands did not work.
I'm more and more willing to buy the Quectel RM502Q-AE even if old it seems to me the modem with the best aggregations, have you ever heard of it @eider ?
Re: Which is the best 5G modem compatible with RoS7.
Entire RM5xx/RG5xx series will work fine on any ROS version v7.1+, since it is used by MikroTik in Chateau. RM502Q series aggregation abilities for 2xNR are limited though due to X55 used inside. For better performance you'd need to move to RM520N series based on X62.I'm more and more willing to buy the Quectel RM502Q-AE even if old it seems to me the modem with the best aggregations, have you ever heard of it @eider ?
Please beware of cheap listings selling variants customized for laptop vendors that do not support communication over USB. Such variants can be distinguished by AP instead of AA in their product code.
Firehose firmware update methods reboots modem in EDL mode and uploads full image. For DFOTA process, you need special delta package. Note that generally speaking, upgrading between different revisions is not supported (the base revision refers to Rxx part of firmware version and is base image provided by Qualcomm) unless previously confirmed by Quectel. You are on your own there.I had to use Qfirehose because the very convenient DFOTA commands did not work.
Re: Which is the best 5G modem compatible with RoS7.
for the 502q-ae I had read on an official note that it supported 2 NRs that's why I particularly liked it
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