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tasn
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Location: Ioannina, Greece

PtMP 4km Advice

Sat Jul 02, 2016 3:10 pm

Hello, This is one of my first attempts to "play" wirelessly with mikrotik devices.

The target is to send vdsl from point A to point B (50/5). I don't have line of sight from point A to point B so i decided to connect the two points to a 3rd point C.
So i installed at point C a basebox RB912UAG-5HPnD-OUT with a mANT 15s and i took for point A and B two LHG 5

The distance from Point A to C is 4KM(Mikrotik says 5KM)
The distance from Point B to C is 4KM 
Point A and B have a distance from each other 500m but unfortunately no line of sight.
Point A and point B have a clear line of sight with point C

The vdsl modem is in point A and lets say it has an ip address 192.168.1.1
I have configured LHG at point A as 
Ip Address : 192.168.1.254
Station Bridge
5GHz-only-N
20MHz width
NV2
Supported Rates A/G : 6,9,12,18,24Mbps
Basic Rates A/G: 6
Hw-Retries : 3
AMPDU Priorities : 0,1,2,3,4,5,6,7
HT-Supported MCS: MCS0 - MCS7
HT-Basic MCS : MCS0-MCS1

With those settings it is connected with 
TX/RX Signal Strength : -68/-61 
Signal to Noise : 54 dB
Noise Floor : -115
Tx/Rx CCQ : 50/90(This is the maximum ccq i get. It is very unstable)


I have configured LHG at point B as 
Ip Address : 192.168.1.252
Station
5GHz-only-N
20MHz width
NV2
Supported Rates A/G : 6,9,12,18,24Mbps
Basic Rates A/G: 6
Hw-Retries : 3
AMPDU Priorities : 0,1,2,3,4,5,6,7
HT-Supported MCS: MCS0 - MCS7
HT-Basic MCS : MCS0-MCS1

With those settings it is connected with 
TX/RX Signal Strength : -68/-61 
Signal to Noise : 55 dB
Noise Floor : -115
Tx/Rx CCQ : 80/90(This is the maximum ccq i get. It is very unstable)

I also have LHG at point B configured at router mode 

Point C
Ip Address : 192.168.1.253
AP Bridge
5GHz-only-N
20MHz width
Frequency 5660
NV2
Supported Rates A/G : 6,9,12,18,24Mbps
Basic Rates A/G: 6
Hw-Retries : 3
AMPDU Priorities : 0,1,2,3,4,5,6,7
HT-Supported MCS: MCS0 - MCS23
HT-Basic MCS : MCS0-MCS3
TDMA - Period Size : 2ms
Cell Radius 10km
Tx Power : Default
At status it shows Noise Floor : -119dBm

With the above settings the maximum i can get at point B is only 10mbps download and 5 upload
So the questions are should i wait better results with the equipment i have?
Have i made wrong configuration? With the default settings(default data rates, MCS etch i had 4/4mbps so with the above settings i achieved 10/5)

I feel like i am losing sth here.

I am using wireless-cm2 package now at all devices but i had same results also with wireless-fp.

Some more infos
i have speedtest from device A and B to C like
Send :  30Mbps 
Receive : 40 Mbps

Pings vary from 2ms up to 30 with spikes up to 100ms

So any opinions? At what direction should i search? 
Interference?Configuration?Wrong devices?

Thank you in advance.
 
jebz
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Location: Australia

Re: PtMP 4km Advice

Sun Jul 03, 2016 5:43 am

Radio C will have variable ping and traffic latency when it has to receive A then re-transmit on to B.
To improve the performance put another LHG5 at point C for the path A-C.
 
azfar
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Re: PtMP 4km Advice

Sun Jul 03, 2016 7:38 am

(Some more infos
i have speedtest from device A and B to C like
Send :  30Mbps 
Receive : 40 Mbps)


with the equipment that you are using, this is the best you can get. but here are my suggestions, try to improve signal strength by switching to another frequency as you have -68/-61 signal strentgh. the difference between rx/tx values should not be more than 2 digits...(example....-61/-63 is acceptable).
second ....try to use anyother protocol beside using NV2...sometimes, depending on the weather NV2 or nstremes dont really help.
Tx/Rx CCQ : 50/90(This is the maximum ccq i get. It is very unstable)
try getting CCQ above 80%. which  is kinda difficult with basebox and mANT 15s as they have antenna gain below 18dbi. although the distance is only 4km.
last but not least....in the world of wireless connections we always have different results depending on the locations. so keep trying for better results.
Regards,
Azfar Hameed Khan 
 
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tasn
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Location: Ioannina, Greece

Re: PtMP 4km Advice

Sun Jul 03, 2016 1:09 pm

Radio C will have variable ping and traffic latency when it has to receive A then re-transmit on to B.
To improve the performance put another LHG5 at point C for the path A-C.
Pings vary also when the links are idle.
try getting CCQ above 80%. which  is kinda difficult with basebox and mANT 15s as they have antenna gain below 18dbi. although the distance is only 4km.
So do you think i could pass 50mbps if i replace the antenna with a bigger one? Or even better if i get two more LHG?
Anyway another clarification...there is power output + antenna gain. Should i always use the antenna gain? 
In my country there is limit at 30dbm for 5Ghz and i have configured default power output for basebox with antenna gain 0. What would be the optimal setting for this.
And for LHG also.
I ll try to lower the RX signal strength also and see what happens.
Thank you both.
 
azfar
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Re: PtMP 4km Advice

Mon Jul 04, 2016 8:34 am

I ll try to lower the RX signal strength also and see what happens.

ya try that first. it would really help.

and for the distance of 4 KM i would use antennas with 27 dbi on all sites. (if my target is above 50Mbps speed)
and yes ping results vary when there is traffic passing through the radios. so try pinging and switching the frequencies when no one is using them.
do not only focus on signal strength but also keep in mind other factors like CCQ, throughput, and ping time between radios.

to gain 50Mbps i would suggest customising your radios...RB411 with good mini PCI that supports "ac" series. and use some new antennas from RF elements.
http://www.rfelements.com/products/

again before you change your equipment and spend more money ask yourself do you really need that much speed (50 Mbps).
i am running a WISP since 2012 and the best http://www.speedtest.net  i have ever achieved so far  is 48 Mbps. (not talking about bandwidth test between radios)
in 4 years i never received any complain about internet speed from any of my customer. some of my clients like to watch youtube videos with HD (1080p) format and they are very happy. 
just in case you want to know about my equipment, I mostly use Groove with kenbotong antennas.
Regards
 
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tasn
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Re: PtMP 4km Advice

Tue Jul 05, 2016 12:22 pm

I don't really need 50mbps for me. Behind point B there are some clients(friends) who i would like to share my vdsl with.
With this equipment i didn't really wait to achieve 50mbps full but i would at least wait 20-25mbps.

Anyway i saw something strange to me yesterday. If i use http://www.speedtest.net/ i get from 5-10 mbps download. But if i try to download a torrent for testing i see speeds of 2mb/sec (megabytes)

Is it possible that there is something wrong with the configuration besides the rf part? 

As far as the radios concerned thanks a lot for the suggestions. I ll let you know for the progress.
 
azfar
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Re: PtMP 4km Advice

Sun Jul 10, 2016 9:27 am

torrents should not be the measurement tool of the speed test, because torrents depends on numbers of seeders and leechers who are uploading data to one another and moreover measurements in mikrotik is measured in bits not bytes so if you are downloading data of 1.0 MB in u torrent, you will see the Queue speed (or WAN interface) in mikrotik, reaching up to 10 Mbps. 
anyway good luck with your Experiments.
Regards
 
jebz
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Location: Australia

Re: PtMP 4km Advice

Mon Jul 11, 2016 2:37 am

Radio C will have variable ping and traffic latency when it has to receive A then re-transmit on to B.
To improve the performance put another LHG5 at point C for the path A-C.
Pings vary also when the links are idle.
The wireless router at C is causing your throughput issue. It has to buffer the incoming packets from A then re-transmit them to B.

This situation is the same as in a domestic environment in a home when someone needs to add stronger wifi to the back of the house. It's mostly recommended not to use a wireless repeater mode but to connect with an ethernet cable back to the main router.

In your case add a LHG5 at C for the A-C path like the ethernet cable in the domestic solution. This will then still enable you to have multiple friends connect to the C repeater with good performance.

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